Boy Scouts Set to Reverse Policy on Gay Membership
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BY JOHN CHAPPELL
Staff Writer
Gay Boy Scouts and Scout leaders wouldn't have to hide their sexuality if a new policy removes a longstanding Boy Scouts of America ban on gays.
A national policy change expected later this month will hit local Scout troops and Cub Scout packs differently, depending on their sponsoring organizations.
It could hit Moore County even more directly. Troops come from all over for summer stays at Camp Durant and Camp Reeve, parts of the sprawling Occoneechee Scout Reservation between Robbins and Carthage.
"Currently, the BSA is discussing potentially removing the national membership restriction regarding sexual orientation," said Deron Smith, director of public relations for the National Council. "This would mean there would no longer be any national policy regarding sexual orientation, and the chartered organizations that oversee and deliver Scouting would accept membership and select leaders consistent with each organization's mission, principles or religious beliefs. BSA members and parents would be able to choose a local unit that best meets the needs of their families."
Girl Scouts don't have a similar anti-gay policy, or any policy at all on sexual preferences.
"For more than 100 years, Scouting's focus has been on working together to deliver the nation's foremost youth program of character development and values-based leadership training," Smith said, in a statement posted online. "Scouting has always been in an ongoing dialogue with the Scouting family to determine what is in the best interest of the organization and the young people we serve."
While there may be considerable back channel talk about the change privately, there was little to be heard about it last week during the Court of Honor and dinner of Troop 223 at Brownson Memorial Presbyterian Church in Southern Pines.
Scouts and Scouters there mostly talked about the recent camping trip to Fort Fisher and an upcoming 20-mile overnight hike in the Uwharries.
"We will wait and see what the national organization will do," said Lee Leonard, who chairs the church's committee.
Nicholas Long, the professional District Executive Scout who serves the county, said the council's executive, John Akerman, is handling any questions about how Occoneechee will deal with changes, if any.
The proposal would only remove language from national policy and application forms. It has always been up to any sponsor - church, civic club or other organization - to approve or disapprove applications. That wouldn't change, even if the national executive board makes this about-face on sexual orientation.
In England, birthplace of the Boy Scouts, policies changed long ago to one of welcome. British Scout Association guidelines are supportive of individual members regardless of their sexual orientation.
Contact John Chappell at (910) 783-5841 or jfchappell @gmail.com.
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Comments
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
As a former Life scout I totally support lifting that ban on gays in the scouting. Although I do not agree with the concept of gay marriage the issue for me never been hate.....I think they will have to deal with issues such as sharing tents etc. No matter how tolerant you are, you cant force people to accept people that may be lusting at you, of the same sex. that will never change.
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Spocks_Brain: I think you'll find that most "lusters" are Heterosexual men and you don't have to worry about the gays. I think most of their lusting will be on redecorating your den.
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
CourseaireI dont need ANY f___ lecture from you, pal...
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
But you were doing so well with your 1st two lines, you should have stopped there.
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Oh oracle of tolerance and wisdom let me kneel before you
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Ill tell you one thing we cant get ONE day without gay news in our faces, Im tired of it, it needs to stop.
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
If you are going to share a tent with a gay guy be my guest
wcs 3 months, 2 weeks ago
I think the funniest thing about the anti-gay stance of the Boy Scouts is that the Boy Scouts is the gayest thing I've ever been involved with in my entire life.
packwilleat 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Brings a whole new meaning to the Backpacking merit badge.
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Our troop was awesome but there were odd cliques turns out 2 of the patrol leaders were being used by the peadophile pastor of the church where the troop was based-when the pastor was outed he committed suicide...so...we can be for all things gay and be tolerant and all this crap..but there are consequences...; and turns out the Presbytery there new about the pastor and never outed him...like I said...this obsession with tolerance has consequences.
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Spocks_Brain - Did you by any chance go to SoMeck HS?
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
No I did not
Yukonjohn 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Pack, you are just wrong man!! LMAO...l almost shot coffee out my nose when l read your last comment!!! As a former scout, l know it was wrong, but that was TOO funny!!!
geoffcutler 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Based on an ABC news report this morning, the Boy Scouts of America and their board have decided to table their decision on whether to open their membership. Apparently they are going to continue to discuss it before making their final decision. At least that's what I thought I heard.
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
I hope they can vote yea and just practice tolerance-like I said earlier there will be thorny issues but kids today are much more tolerant-feeling a certain way does not mena acting that way overtly
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Pack - That was funny. For anyone concerned about gays in scouts should watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMrQw8...
packwilleat 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Yukon- i was a scout too. Made it to star before our troop disbanded. We had a lot of good times and learned how to survive on our own. I'm still confident I could walk out my door with nothing but my ka-bar and do just fine.
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Pack & Yuk - I was a scout in Ca. and I'm still confident I could walk out my door with nothing, into a bar and do just fine.
teufelhunden 3 months, 2 weeks ago
LOL Courseaire!!!
Thatcher 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Holy Christmas! You guys are just too funny! And geoff, you heard correctly: the Scouts have tabled any decision until May. Cheers!
buskwon 3 months, 2 weeks ago
by buskwon
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
buskwon 3 months, 2 weeks ago
A scoutmaster and a rabbi were walking by a park and they saw a black kid on the swing, the scoutmaster said let's screw the black kid, The rabbi said out of what?
buskwon 3 months, 2 weeks ago
I would like to apologize for my last statement, I did not mean to offend any rabbie or black kid.
nothingspecial 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Keep it up Courseaire and busk won, best comments in years!
Thatcher 3 months, 2 weeks ago
nothingspecial-- Agreed 100%! These threads could use a little more humor. And Courseaire, as always, is the funniest guy here. I've spit sweet tea, spilled sweet tea, and almost dumped a whole bowl of chili laughing with him and his posts. Then he posts some great serious stuff, which is spot-on, then he goes back to making us pee in our pants. Sir Courseaire, we're glad you're here! You make everyone's day more fun. Cheers my friend!
JD 3 months, 2 weeks ago
So this is the new troll thread eh?
Bashing gays and black kids. You guys are incorregible. Well let's see now...
What's the difference between Boy Scouts & Jews? Boy Scouts come back from camp.
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
JD - I think you and Bushwon crossed the line with your attempt at humor.
Middleman522 3 months, 2 weeks ago
I would like to know how this makes Scouting better. This is not a good idea and the results could and will be devastating for some young boys. How is it that a gay man thinks he has a right to lead young boys, but the Boy Scouts don't have a right to eliminate this possibility from accuring? Who are we kidding here? It's like putting Bill Clinton in charge of a girls college dorm. It's not that all gay men are a risk, but straight men are far less a risk to the same sex!! Background checks are definitely needed for scouting anyway. This is just not necessary. Boys at this age do not know right from wrong when it comes to sex. They look up to Scout Masters and trust them to teach. PC gone wild!
packwilleat 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Middleman- it's just an attempt to emasculate males at a young age.
teufelhunden 3 months, 2 weeks ago
There are pervs everywhere...
JD 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Courseaire 2 hours, 26 minutes ago JD - I think you and Bushwon crossed the line with your attempt at humor.
What you think and $3.50 will get a cup of coffee. Besides all 3 jokes came off the same web page. So if cunnilingus performed by minors is ok by you to joke about, then the other two are fair game. Careful you don't fall into Thatcher finger waving hypocrisy levels.
Besides the last joke being crude it is a step better than the gay porn Bushkwon used to post.
Also... Oh oracle of tolerance and wisdom let me kneel before you For a guy with gay on the brain he really just adds to that closet case persona doesn't he?
Cheers! Excelsior!
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
JD - OK, I'll give you Buskwon as worse and I'll take your $3.50 for coffee. Mine & Pack's use double entendre where yours & Buskwon don't. I think there lays the difference.
Middleman522 - You are way off base. A gay man could lead a group of boys and teach them the same as any straight man.
Middleman522 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Courseaise Coulda Woulda Shoulda don't count here. We are playing with little boy's lives here. They should start their own group for gay scouts. But taking little boys on camping trips is something that can't be PC. We have to get it right. I did not say gay men can't lead. I say we have enough child molestation in this country now, without opening up a can of gay worms! How can this help BOY SCOUTS? It only makes gay politics happy. That is all! If it happens just once, this decision will have failed! Period! And it's too late!
packwilleat 3 months, 2 weeks ago
But who knows where a gay moral compass my lead them? Lat/Long are "straight" lines for a reason!!
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Well, we could have them lead by Catholic priests and maybe a Cardinal or two, then they'd be safe.
jonathan_poverud 3 months, 2 weeks ago
As an Eagle Scout who has seen many good men turn their Eagle Medal back in because the BSA discriminated against their sexual preference, I hope the Boy Scouts will hurry up and remember that Lieutenant-General Lord Baden-Powell saw the need to train boys in the arts of camping, orientation (land navigation not sexual), a sense of community spirit and becoming productive members of society.
He defied a long standing class system that was in place in Britain in the early 20th century and took boys of all backgrounds into his program. Society scoffed and mocked. The world Scouting Program has been one of the greatest things to happen to children.
After earning my Eagle, I worked at a summer camp and had deal with a happily married, heterosexual scoutmaster molesting a child, At that same camp we had a scouter who wasn't every-ones idea of manly and he was falsely accused. The Boy Scouts need to remain ever vigilant and guard against any adult being one on one with a child. The policy is there must be more than one child or more than one adult.
Sexual activity of any kind (homo or hetro) is prohibited, for obvious reasons, at any scouting function.
I hope the BSA will move forward on this issue and get back to their core mission.
Themis 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Go ahead America, Go ahead Boy Scouts, toss our most precious possession (young people) into the belly of the beast. Sentence your children who’s minds are not mature and vulnerable to soak up homosexual behaviors of those they look up to and model themselves after. Add confusion to their world that is already confused enough. They are like the potter’s clay, and will mold to whatever shape we offer. Why not instead give them an honest chance at living a life of a normal human on this earth. What is normal? I know, you know, we all know what is normal. But for those who question normal, Themis will explain. It is the scientific purpose and design of the Creator that all things shall perpetuate and reproduce thereby extending the living line of its’ genus and species. From the simple cell to the mighty blue whale, the primary object of nearly all living things is ensure the next generation of its descendants. Homosexuality goes against all the laws of nature, scientific extension of genus and species, and is a forbidden blasphemy of the Bible and the Christian God. No ands - no ifs - no buts. Judging from all that Themis knows about the BSA, their root and base is of Christianity and service to God and Country as stated in the “Boy Scout Oath and Promise”…….On my honor, I will do my best To do my duty to God and my country and to obey the Scout Law; To help other people at all times; To keep myself physically strong, mentally awake and morally straight. Themis also knows that in recent years the CEO of the Boy Scouts of America’s employment package was close to 1.6 million dollars, which is higher than 90% of all other CEO’s of fortune 500 companies in the U.S. Perhaps the CEO is willing to alter the entire soul of the BSA to ensure his reign and income, perhaps they fear that government aid may be blocked if the BSA excludes gays since our current elected in D.C. love it so. But what likely will happen if the BSA allows homosexuals into their leadership is this: Most scouting packs are supported and sub financed by the churches of America. By going against the law of the Bible, the BSA can bet that most churches of integrity will pull their financial and community support. Donations will tumble, and gifts from the community of free land, free use of buildings, and volunteering will decrease. So in the end, it will be our young people who will pay the price for America’s excessive willingness to jump onto the gay –train everyone seems to want to ride so badly, and the BSA may ride it all the way to destruction.
packwilleat 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Speaking in third person is gay......
jonathan_poverud 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Themis, The current scout executive is not the one who made $ 1.6 million dollars that was the one who took and fought gay scouts admission into the program all the way to the Supreme Court. That was when I quit supporting them financially, if a scout is gay but upholds the rules of the organization discrimination is wrong. I am sorry your love of your God, brings you to hate your fellow man. I don't think Jesus who washed the feet of prostitutes and begged for forgiveness for those who crucified him is going to preach hate.
Wayne Brock the current Chief Scout Executive, and North Carolina Native, was the Council Executive where I got my Eagle and personally worked hard everyday to protect the children of our council.
Finally, fortune 500 CEOs make well more than $ 1.6 million dollars. Probably closer to 1.6 BILLION. LAW OF THE BIBLE: Exodus 20:16: Thou Shall Not Bear False Witness.
Themis 3 months, 2 weeks ago
The Chief Scout Executive, the CEO of the Boy Scouts of America National Council, receives a salary of $1,577,600. This places the Boy Scouts of America National Council CEO as the highest paid CEO in the Human Services Category. (Charity Navigator lists the BSA in the Human Services Category.)
Five highest CEO Salaries: University of Delaware – $2,377,100 Salk Institute for Biological Studies – $2,027,891 Rochester Institute of Technology – $1,656,261 Citi Performing Arts Center – $1,644,331 Boy Scouts of America National Council – $1,577,600
jonathan_poverud 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Themis you said Fortune 500 companies.
"Themis also knows that in recent years the CEO of the Boy Scouts of America’s employment package was close to 1.6 million dollars, which is higher than 90% of all other CEO’s of fortune 500 companies in the U.S. Perhaps the CEO is willing to alter the entire soul of the BSA to ensure his reign and income, perhaps they fear that government aid may be blocked if the BSA excludes gays since our current elected in D.C. love it so."
The charities and educational institutions are NOT fortune 500 companies. Think Wal-Mart, Apple, IBM, etc. The CEO of Wal-Mart makes 35 million yet, he is not on the top of your list. You mean charities.
packwilleat 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Jonathan- Themis used to be a "profit" you should listen, take notes, and most importantly..... never question the Themis(profit).
Themis 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Yes Jonathan, I meant charity ceo's but I did not make that clear and I stand corrected. Thank you for pointing that out. As for packwilleat, if speaking and writing in the 3rd person is gay, than you have insulted Ernest Hemminway's "For whom the Bell Tolls" - Mark Twain's "The Adventures of Tom Sawyer" and F. Scott Fitzgerald's "The Great Gatsby. You should also look up just who Themis was. But if nothing else was accomplished from my post, at least it will light a fire in those who post here and we can realize how important this topic is. I simply had the coconuts to say what many of you are thinking. If your heart tells you otherwise I am sure we will read it shortly. If making fun of me allows this to happen and causes readers to draw their lines in the sand as to where they truly stand, than any ill-thought comments or stones you may throw at me are worth the sacrifice. Homosexuality is clearly condemned in the Bible. But, it also goes against the created order of God who made Adam, a man, and Eve, a woman -- not two men, not two women -- to carry out his command to fill and subdue the earth (Gen. 1:28). Homosexuality cannot carry out that command. It is, therefore, a contradiction to God's stated desire in the created order.
Unlike other sins, homosexuality has a heavy judgment administered by God Himself upon those who commit it - and support it. This judgment is simple in that those who practice it are given over to their passions - which means that their hearts are allowed to be hardened by their sins.
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Find me a current scout leader that doesn't commit these last two sins almost daily (and that means thinking it, you don't have to do it physically to commit the sin):
You shall not covet your neighbor's wife.
You shall not covet your neighbor's goods.
jimt 3 months, 2 weeks ago
"You should also look up just who Themis was."
Greek Titan, female, represented "rightful order of things." Ordered proper relationships, ordered proper behavior of men and women.
Yeah, I can see where you get your self-righteous, self-congratulatory, and self-important attitudes from, and why you chose Themis as your nom de plume.
But this quote from you confuses me somewhat, :Unlike other sins, homosexuality has a heavy judgment administered by God Himself upon those who commit it - and support it."
So why not leave it to God Himself to administer the judgment? Does he/she/it really need your help? Seems to me that anyone who can create a planet in six days doesn't really need your assistance, or advice.
foregolf 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Since when does being gay make someone a child molester?
geoffcutler 3 months, 2 weeks ago
This topic confuses me. Why is it that there has been just outrage over The Catholic Church and some of its priests who have caused such pain to young males, yet no-one in favor of the Boy Scouts accepting gays into their organization seems to be worried that the same couldn't happen with them? Supposing the Scouts change their policy on gay membership, and it is discovered that a hetero child is molested by a gay scout master? What happens then?
And what is motivating all this? Does a child joining the Boy Scouts know he is gay already? Is there some waiting list of 10 year old gay boys out there waiting to join the Scouts, but can't because of the organization's current codes? Or this about mature gay males waiting in line to be scout leaders?
This whole thing sounds really strange, and is quite confusing.
jimt 3 months, 2 weeks ago
"Supposing the Scouts change their policy on gay membership, and it is discovered that a hetero child is molested by a gay scout master? What happens then?"
The gay scout master will be charged, indicted (if there is enough evidence for a grand jury), tried, and if found guilty, go to jail.
It's my understanding that this is called "the justice system."
It's also my understanding that a number of boys have already been molested by their "straight" scout masters over the years. Maybe the Boy Scouts should reconsider allowing straight scout masters into their ranks.
geoffcutler 3 months, 2 weeks ago
You're saying that molestation of boys is par for the course in the Boy Scouts, so what difference does it make? Is that it? I suppose that clears up part of my confusion.
clarabelle 3 months, 2 weeks ago
" Spocks_Brain -If you are going to share a tent with a gay guy be my guest"
You........... are the dumbest......... most abrasive.........ignorant..........imbecilic - poster here!
and all the above - are compliments ................
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Geoff- what he's saying is that there are child molesters out there and there is no distinction between whether they are straight. So far records show that only straight BS leaders have molested BS
geoffcutler 3 months, 2 weeks ago
What? A supposed hetero male molests a scout, and he's considered straight? Now, I'm really confused.
Middleman522 3 months, 2 weeks ago
So are these PC punks, confused, out there driving our kids down a dirt road, everyday between hollywood, the news, music, and union teachers that have agendas. This will not help the Boy Scouts. This will help the radical left with their progressive agenda. So you put this molester in jail. WHAT ABOUT THE BOY? You can't just wash this crap off. It's with you for the rest of your life. I know what I'm talking about! The risk is too great! Period. Do you think a 40-50 year old single man should take Girl Scouts camping?? This is more progressive spin that this country does not need. Why don't you radical activists find some other group to play with. Kids are defenseless and you are playing with their lives! Wake up!!
Courseaire 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Geoff- That makes him a perv.
geoffcutler 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Oh, okay. I think I'm getting it now. A hetero male who sexually molests a Boy Scout is a "perv," but is still classified as sexually "straight." Is that it?
packwilleat 3 months, 2 weeks ago
But the question still remains.... who is gayer, the pitcher or the catcher?
jimt 3 months, 2 weeks ago
"A supposed hetero male molests a scout, and he's considered straight? Now, I'm really confused."
It probably means he knowingly lied when he said he was straight and became a scout leader, or that he was "latent" until he was "platent."
Less confused now?
And I don't think child molestation in the boy scouts is "par for the course," it's clearly a triple bogey.
I think the center fielder is probably getting it from both sides.
Thatcher 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Wow! This thread has taken some twists and turns. To me, I think some here are forgetting a major fact: the BSA has tabled any decision on allowing gay scout masters until May. The Supreme Court has already ruled in 2000 that BSA can exclude gays: http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/06/us-usa-boyscouts-gays-idUSBRE9150HE20130206. The question now is whether BSA wants to change their mind, for whatever reason, and now admit them. I believe in liberty, and thus believe that BSA can decide any way they want. It's not my decision and it's not yours...it's the BSA's decision to make...and then your decision whether to continue support BSA or allow your son to join the Scouts. Lastly, I would hope that some of my Christian brothers and sisters would consider what I have repeatedly posted here, and what Couresaire (2 hours, 31 min. ago) so cogently summarized: every one of us is a sinner, and the Bible (to my knowledge) has no tier system of sins...from worst to acceptable. I plainly admit that I am a sinner, and I believe my sins are no more acceptable than the sin of homosexuality. Plus, I am not the judge, God is, and I will never place myself into a position of telling folks how He ultimately will view things or to condemn certain sinners when I myself should be condemned. I hope that some of my Christian brothers and sisters will give this some thought. Cheers!
geoffcutler 3 months, 2 weeks ago
You said, "It's also my understanding that a number of boys have already been molested by their "straight" scout masters over the years. Maybe the Boy Scouts should reconsider allowing straight scout masters into their ranks."
So I thought that meant, hey, the hetero's are already doing it, so the boys aren't safe anyway. So why exclude gay men?
Building fires, hiking and camping sure gets lost in all this, doesn't it?
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
ClaraBelle I said I'm for lifting the ban-but you as a woman,just dont get it...in my boarding school we had a 'cleansing' unit, similar to an ethnic cleansing 'unit' that totally went after Gays with extreme prejudice-call it law of the jungle-I never approved of it then and dont now..I just choose not to share a tent; I have no animus towards Gays only object to gay marriage
dentman65 3 months, 2 weeks ago
Thatcher - You are indeed are a good and kind soul. I too have not heard of a tier of sin. Sin is sin and will be judged accordingly. But if we as Christians support sin and turn the other cheek away from sin, it is almost like a double edged sword. When do the Christians know when to say enough is enough? Can Christians stand by and allow the world to be swallowed up while doing nothing and let our beliefs be bulldozed from around us? I hope someone can offer a great answer as to when to turn and when to fight. Make it a great day!
Spocks_Brain 3 months, 2 weeks ago
One thing is for sure, the Gays want a normal life-alas it will always be controversial. One agenda vs another. You have to admit 2 mommies 2 daddies, wells its FUBAR...just accusing someone of being gay or claiming a same sex attraction can be fatal...happened on a talk show a few years back..so here we are....free to pursue happiness that's the bottom line, but there are still boundaries...
Thatcher 3 months, 2 weeks ago
dentman65-- Thanks for the kind post. "Can Christians stand by and allow the world to be swallowed up while doing nothing and let our beliefs be bulldozed from around us?" To me, the answer is simple: Christians, live your lives and live what you believe! Not a single person...nor a single government... can ever "bulldoze" your beliefs. They have no such power over you, unless you let them. I will never give them that power. My beliefs are not affected by elections. And whether gays are allowed to marry or not, I'd still hug them and say, "Welcome sinner! I'm just like you!" Because I am. And if I may be so bold, so are you and everyone else here. That's what I believe. Cheers!
buskwon 3 months, 2 weeks ago
http://vimeo.com/24069503
LSM 3 months, 2 weeks ago
@ dentman65 and Thatcher
It is hard to watch a society go into such a depraved spiral, but this has been the repeated over and over again story of mankind. Nothing new to see here, just sin upon sin, slowly filling the cup of wrath until judgment.
There is hope for the believer in Christ Jesus. Read the Holy Spirit inspired words of Paul in Romans Chapter 11 from verse 1 to verse 36. I'm sure ready to take on this day whatever may come.
Thatcher 3 months, 2 weeks ago
LSM-- Things such as this are for the most part out of our hands. But we don't have to join them. Cheers!