Where Much of the Real Financial Blame Might Lie

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Like many of us, I would like to jail those persons who are responsible for the Great Recession.

Most of us know someone who lost his home over the past few years. Many of us are familiar with a family who slipped from middle-class comfort to government dependence. This is intolerable and cries out for justice.

I do not know the names of all those who should be jailed. But I would like to start with North Carolina insurance commissioners present and past - Wayne Goodwin and, if he were still alive, Jim Long - and others like them nationwide.

Most people understand that our recession began when worthless mortgage-backed securities were sold as "Triple A Paper" to banks like Charlotte-based Bank of America, initiated by its subsidiary, Countrywide Mortgage. Those sales were made possible only by something called a "credit default swap." And that is where Goodwin and Long needed to pay attention. They did not. The result was that many Americans lost their future.

So what is a "credit default swap"? Simply put, it is a policy of insurance. The banks or holders of notes purchase the policies to make sure they do not lose money on defaulted mortgages to dirt-poor homeowners. If a homeowner does not pay for his home, the insurance company pays the bank instead. The bank cannot lose unless the insurance company goes broke. And it did.

The problem is that these insurance policies were called "credit default swaps" because they were sold by investment companies, not insurance companies. And selling insurance without a license is a crime.

Insurance companies are regulated. The sale of insurance is restricted to licensed agents and regulated companies because government is supposed to make sure that in case of disaster, insurance companies remain solvent and policy holder claims are paid.

But our Insurance commissioners, as did others everywhere, failed Bank of America, Countrywide and the people. Banks were purchasing and arranging for purchase an insurance policy from companies that were never subjected to the scrutiny that the insurance commissioner should require.

Blatantly selling insurance without a license simply because the policy is called a "swap" is like a barber stating he does not need a license because he is not "cutting hair," he is "trimming" it. Such a barber would either go to jail or be ordered to read Shakespeare. But jailing a Wall Street securities salesman selling worthless paper in Charlotte is not as easy when both salesman and customer contribute to campaigns and employ lobbyists.

Yet that is not the entirety of the problem. As we read here today, credit default swaps are being bought and sold just as if nothing has happened. Goodwin remains oblivious to the problem. And they have expanded. These swaps now insure everything from leases to Greek debt.

Putting aside the Democrat/Republican argument as to whether the underlying cause of the recession was the lack of regulation by George W. Bush or the pressure to lend by Barney Frank, we can all agree that the immediate cause of the recession was a simple Depression Era "run on the bank."

When the homeowners could not pay and banks made insurance claims, the money was not available. Had the swaps been properly regulated as insurance, then the commissioner would have made sure sufficient reserves were available or would have, more likely, shut down the business in North Carolina. This would have led to fewer mortgages, fewer defaults, and, possibly, an easing or, locally, an avoidance of recession.

Of course, some would say this is a federal problem. But where there is federal inaction, state regulators from among the states frequently unite in national lawsuits such as the suit that destroyed tobacco. And the Marlboro Man never caused financial disaster.

It is also interesting that the continued interstate sales of "mortgage insurance swaps" remains an unregulated federal matter; but, the federal government insists that selling interstate health insurance must be outlawed. Blue Cross never caused recession.

As Republicans, we cannot abrogate our responsibility to regulate where regulation is necessary. Where the federal government refuses to act, state officials must act. Or, at the very least, they must join with other states to properly regulate insurance, no matter what a charlatan might call it.

Robert M. Levy is chairman of the Moore County Republican party. Contact him at Law52@prodigy.net.

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Comments

dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

Mr. Levy, I believe you're an attorney. Can you provide any legal authority for jailing Commissioners of Insurance or heads of other regulatory bodies for failing to regulate? Can you provide a citation from Chapter 58 that brings these particular instruments under the jurisdiction of the Department of Insurance?

I look forward to your answers, kthxbai.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

Anyone who writes on this topic who does not mention Brooksley Born (then head of the CFTC) and her efforts bring derivatives under regulatory control only to be crushed by the Bush Administrations treasury people (with the aid of the Fed) is missing the most important part of the story.

This mess could have been avoided but the people charged with keeping our financial system stable were either asleep at the switch or bought and paid for by Wall Street. You need look no further.

Our state insurance people were out gunned by an industry that was able to buy federal protection against which state regulations are useless.

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MichaelFlorence 1 year, 1 month ago

To Jim Heim

I agree with you. These swaps are nothing but a shell game to push money around. BUT quit bashing the last adminstration. President Obama has been there for almost 4 years. Two years with the Democrats in charge of the House and Senate. And nothing has changed. Nothing. I cannot remember a single speech where the President has even mentioned these swaps. All we have gotten out of Congress is the fisaco of the Dodd-Frank Bill. Seems ironic that by the time major portions of that bill get active, both of those gentleman will be out of office. Lets see how you react when the small business credit market drys up due to new lending standards.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

Michael, you are absolutely correct. This adminstartion has done little more than the last to rectify these problems. From here it looks like Goldman, JP Morgan and the other Wall Street players have their tentacles so deep into the Treasury Department and the Fed that they should be listed as wholly-owned subsidiaries. And the SEC is definitely the most corrupt federal agency in history.

The question is, since neither party is able to do anything about it (and I don't see an entity with the clout), where do we go for help? It's all about money and Wall Street has enough to corrupt any administration.

Still, it was during the Bush years that the most egregious violations occurred. It adds to a long list of failures in my mind.

And the best Mr. Levy can do is bash state regulators. Small fish, I say.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

It should be noted that our state regulators were prohibited from dealing with CDS's. Via Barry Ridholtz:

The Commodity Futures Modernization Act of 2000 radically deregulated derivatives. The law changed the Commodity Exchange Act of 1936 (CEA) to exempt derivatives transactions from regulations as either “futures” (under the CEA) or “securities” under federal securities laws. Further, the CFMA specifically exempted Credit Defaults Swaps and other derivative products from regulation by any State Insurance Board or Regulators.

You remember Republican Senator Phil Gramm, don't you? He sponsored this bill that pulled the teeth from every agency that might have reined in these dangerous products. I would be delighted to hear from Bob exactly how Wayne Goodwin could have overruled the federal government on this. Really.

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

JimHeim 1 hour, 14 minutes ago ...it was during the Bush years that the most egregious violations occurred. It adds to a long list of failures in my mind.

I'm sure many of those Bush failures (True or otherwise) you speak of will be spoken about by you for many decades to come. It might be a good idea to try an "Etch a Sketch" on your mind. President Bush tried to bring this to the forefront, but was fought back by several key democratic leaders. BTW Jim...I would still love to come hear you present a public speech somewhere. I have asked before if you have any open schedule events that I could attend. I guess you never saw any of my comments as I have not noticed your reply....Mike

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Toyboy52 1 year, 1 month ago

You're wrong Jim. Just because the securities dealers call CDS a derrivative does not make it so. It is insurance . The the CFMA did not deregulate insurance. Nor did it exempt state insurance criminal law.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

MikeNC, You'd be surprised at how seldom a Democratic chair in Moore County gets an opportunity to do any public speaking outside of party functions. Except for my occasional appearances on WEEB's Centerpoint, I am rarely in the public eye.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

toyboy, you have no idea what you're talking about. But I tell you what. There are fifty state insurance commissioners. I'll bet you can find some fine Republican regulator at one of them who took on Wall Street and the federal government to regulate these transactions. Give it you best shot.

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deidretg 1 year, 1 month ago

@Robert Levy; "Like many of us, I would like to jail those persons who are responsible......". Very typical of the local "Party in Power". This tea sipping, social society is all about finding the "financial blame" way out there somewhere. But, let a mention be made of the financial nightmare hatched by some of "their" political underlings in the last few years right here in Carthage on the County level, and they get as quiet as a street walker in a tent revival meeting on a Saturday night. They say that all politics is local. Maybe so, except when the "party in power" has a two to one majority of voters. Then, what we see is all this "national this", "UN that", "State law the other thing". Unfortunately, this crowd is absolutely without restraint on the local financial level when it comes to self serving, pocket lining, future personal planning for all the "people in power" while leaving unfunded worthy "people helping projects" and "schools in need of saving" for future generations. That crowd that created the "national" monster that Mr. Levy is talking about got their money out of it long ago and left that runaway train while the getting was good. Same here, locally. This crowd will have their take from all these boondoggles and be long gone before the poor, unrepresented citizens of this county ever finish paying for their "Vision". When "financial responsibility" should be the watchword on every level top to bottom, this tea sipping, flag waving crowd is just content with rearranging the lounge chairs on the "Titanic" so they can have a better view.

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fugitiveguy 1 year, 1 month ago

"President Bush tried to bring this to the forefront, but was fought back by several key democratic leaders."

Jim and the gang are well aware of the facts contained in the video. It clearly refutes their bold faced lies. There are legitimate areas in which to criticize Bush, this ain't one of them. This video usually has a "kryptonite" effect on the libs.

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fugitiveguy 1 year, 1 month ago

I am not sure if Frank and those other assorted Dems in the video are corrupt or stupid or some combination of the two. But you will never hear Jim H or frankly any of the other Pilot libs criticize one of their own. Its just one big spin-o-rama.

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fugitiveguy 1 year, 1 month ago

Why will no MC libs address the failures of the Democrats in this video?

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Phoenix 1 year, 1 month ago

Why don't we try something new? I would submit that we are all to blame - everyone I know sat back and watched their properties rise in value - no matter if it made sense or not. For example, I had a friend that owned a townhouse in D.C., when he moved (military) he decided not to sell because even though he was losing $2500 per month in rent vs. mortgage, his town house was appreciating over $4500 per month. He decided to keep the town house vs selling - I would submit that his greed cost him in the end.

We all know someone who decided to take the chance - it is ultimately our fault! It's time for us all to take responsibility for our actions - bite the bullet, pay off our debt and get on with it....

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deidretg 1 year, 1 month ago

@fugitiveguy; (Quote) ".........Why will no MC libs address the failures of the Democrats in this video? ......." Same reason 99% of "Republicans" in this county will give a pass to their own crowd as they spend us into overwhelming debt because it suits their "Vision" for our future.

@Phoenix; (Quote) "..... It's time for us all to take responsibility for our actions - bite the bullet, pay off our debt and get on with it....". Well said, Phoenix! Too bad that kind of thinking can't get "anybody" elected in this County. Oh, I quess I should qualify that statement, somewhat. One candidate (Mr. Picerno) does campaign that way, but then he ends up being personally responsible for generating more "county debt" than anybody in recent memory. Basically, this is a playground for the "Want to Be" rich set who have control of the purse strings here in Moore County or, at the very least, have charge over those who control the purse strings in this County and know how to pick up the phone in sticky situations and cut loose $55,200,000 when the "Vision for My People" calls for that kind of "bold" action " in order to make sure the money makes it into the till. Snatch and Grab is more like it.

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

deidretg 6 hours, 32 minutes ago ....Same reason 99% of "Republicans" in this county will give a pass to their own crowd as they spend us into overwhelming debt because it suits their "Vision" for our future.

President Bush did spend too much. The spending was also prior to our so called economic "Melt Down". During the post melt down one would think we would get fiscally responsible...but just the opposite. Obama and crew have allready out spent Bush's 8 years in his three. I would hope that the next president takes this spending issue seriously....Mike

http://www.theblaze.com/blog/2011/08/25/obama-to-outspend-8-years-of-bush-by-march/

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deidretg 1 year, 1 month ago

@MikeNC; "......Bush did spend too much.....". Look, dude, repeat after me "All politics is local". Until you guys are willing to address the "out of control" spending that is happening locally in Moore County (Republicans grab $55,200,000 by force without a vote), then all this blathering about the "out of control" spending going on at the national level is just wasted energy. This is also the major flaw in the "tea time" crowd. They are all about driving 350 miles to Washington, DC to protest what is going on up there but can't be bothered to drive 14 miles to Carthage to protest what is going on there. I suspect that their "tea socials" would not be so pleasant if someone (anyone) among that group were to open up that can of worms. So, sail on brother. The weather is fine. That monstrous object looming off in the distance is no problem. It's just our "Titanic" sized county "jail" that just happens to be outfitted for "federal" prisoners"($95,000 per cell). We didn't need a "Governmental Building" or a "New Courthouse" or that old school (#1 Academy Heights) anyway. Sail on, indeed. The ironi part of all of this is that the monster may actually be settling (i.e sinking) into the partial wetland that it is being built on.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

MikeNC, that's a bold-faced lie. Obama has come nowhere near Bush's record in adding to the national debt. That's just another zombie lie that Republicans think they can pass off as fact.

Anyone who takes Glen Beck's word on anything is certifiable.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

For those who would like us to attack Democrats for these financial shenanigans, I offer this: Both parties are beholden to Wall Street and its corruption. But I believe that only Democrats offer the hope of someday breaking free of their pervasive and malevolent influence. They managed it in the 30's and stabilized our economy for fifty years.

It was Republican legislation (some signed by Democratic presidents) that killed off the regulations that kept us safe. It will be a long, slow fight to wrest control of the economy form the casino operators and grifters who have hijacked it. I expect no help from Republicans.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

Fox's timeline needs work. Republican's controlled congress from 1994 to 2006. Bush was president from 2001 to 2009. Why did they do nothing in all that time to correct the problems caused by those nefarious Democrats? Are they that inept?

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moonchild7 1 year, 1 month ago

This "Liberal" does not look at "Party Lines" what-so-ever when it comes to GREED. And the GUILTY encompass all Politcal Parties. The GUILTY are everywhere, so at this point we shouldn't be looking at the guilty criminals, other than to JAIL them, but we need to look at who the ones are who are finally going to do something about it. If they are Republicans (although I doubt it, but not sure) then they should be commended. Matt Taibbi has been covering this story for Rolling Stone since 2008 and has just written this, in his 3/29/12, "TOO CROOKED TO FAIL" article: 'Bank of America has systematically ripped off almost everyone with whom it has a significant business relationship, cheating investors, insurers, depositors, homeowners, shareholders, pensioners, and tax payers....In the end, it all comes back to mortgages. Though Bank of America would ultimately be charged with committing a dizzingly diverse variety of corporate misdeeds, the bulk of the trouble the bank is in today arises from the Great Mortgage Scam of the mid-2000's, which caused the biggest finacial bubble in history." So, Mr. Levy while the Insurance Companies did have their "sticky hands" in the batter also, the banks with lots of de-regulation laws are the MAJOR culprits. That's why I have my money in a Credit Union.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

harleyman, I knew you wouldn't disappoint me!

I had to laugh at that video because it's a case study in misdirection. Fannie and Freddie had little to do with the housing bubble. It was strip-mall mortgage lenders (along with crooked companies like Countrywide) who made fraudulent loans and then worked with Wall Street con men to package those piles of ... um ... trash to investors and pension funds. At the time Fannie and Freddie were prohibited from buying sub-prime loans.

The fact is both parties benefited from the housing bubble; it concealed the fact that wages were dropping and delayed the recession brought on by Clinton's budget surplus into Bush's first term, making his policies look somewhat better than they were.

Wall Street has infiltrated our treasury department and the Fed to such an extent that presidents can come and go, but the corrupt operators pulling the levers have free reign. And anyone who doubts that the SEC is thoroughly corrupt (to the point that it cannot be saved) is living in a fantasy world.

But at the end of the day, I see a glimmer of hope that Democrats might one day turn this around, while Republicans remain hopelessly lost in a quest to eliminate family planning.

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

I see your Back to name calling as a resort Jim Heim. How about we use some figures from NPR....Here's a short excerpt from the article provided below...Mike

To put that into perspective, when President George W. Bush took office, our national debt was $5.768 trillion. By the time Bush left office, it had nearly doubled, to $10.626 trillion. So Bush's record on deficit spending was not good at all: During his presidency, the national debt rose by an average of $607 billion a year. How does that compare to Obama? During Obama's presidency to date, the national debt has risen by an average of $1.723 trillion a year — or by a jaw-dropping $1.116 trillion more, per year, than it rose even under Bush

http://www.npr.org/2011/01/25/133211508/the-weekly-standard-obama-vs-bush-on-debt

And here's our current national debt clock in motion....you do the math Jim.

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

MikeNC, that's a bold-faced lie

Are you surprised? Remember, Mike & Diane (or as I call them, "Miane") have been caught lying here multiple times. Anything either of them posts should by default be regarded as untrue until independently verified. Click on the username and read the examples I've posted on Miane's wall to see this.

The only thing more predictable than Miane lying is the whining about 'name calling' they do whenever anyone catches them at it.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

Still waiting for the answer to this question:

Can you provide any legal authority for jailing Commissioners of Insurance or heads of other regulatory bodies for failing to regulate? Can you provide a citation from Chapter 58 that brings these particular instruments under the jurisdiction of the Department of Insurance?

Seems to me, if Mr. Levy can't provide these, then his call for the jailing of Mr. Long and Mr. Goodwin is completely irresponsible.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

President Bush did spend too much.

Did you vote for him anyway? Did you vote for Dubbya again after he signed the budget busting Medicare Part D into law without providing for a way to pay for it? If so, then how can you claim that it's really spending you care about, if you stayed silent for eight years of what you yourself call "spending too much"?

This has been another in a long line of questions that you'll never, ever get a Republican to answer.

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Toda 1 year, 1 month ago

From George's own mouth, the start of default swaps and toxic paper that wasn't insured by Full Faith and Credit of the US Government.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

Conservatives like to pin Bush's last budget on Obama to make him look bad. Only works with them.

As the the deficit in general, Obama inherited Bush's tax cuts, his pointless wars and the deregulation that cratered the economy. It won't be easy to fix, but those of us who like this country hope he succeeds. Republicans have a different agenda.

The column this thread is attached to contains numerous fatal errors and should never have been printed. Can any republican supporters here find any law that would allow our insurance commissioner to regulate credit default swaps? Why would we want to put him in jail, except that he's a Democrat?

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Toda 1 year, 1 month ago

After his speech, the markets went haywire and all the corporate crooks jumped into the fray:

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Toda 1 year, 1 month ago

Who was really behind the economic crisis? From his own mouth...or perhaps Mr. Levy will claim the state of the nation was Photoshop. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YsDmPE...

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Toyboy52 1 year, 1 month ago

@ Dusty: There is as much authority to jail an insurance commissioner a's there is to jail a President who commits perjury or a President who ignores the Constitution by appointing federal officers who require Senate approval without such approval and while Congress is I'n session. The Democrat Council of State acts like any Democrat DA from Durham, If given the choice of a jail cell or public office, the public chooses jail.

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Toyboy52 1 year, 1 month ago

@Dusty. After a great amount of research. I could not find authority to jail an insurance commissioner, but I have found authority to jail a liberal columnist, It will have to wait for the completion of the revolution, but it will occur. I have spoken with Newt. He promises that when he is President the Justice Department will investigate and prosecute felonious boredom. It is a Capial Offense especially when it pertains to government. Defenses do include proof of a lack of or defect In the HB23 gene which involves defective humor.

Nonetheless, be aware that the use of medical marijuana is a possible cure, but that is still illegal I'n NC. Hence, I suggest use of peyote on a reservation of the Navajo Nation in Window Rock, Arizona

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

@ Dusty: There is as much authority to jail an insurance commissioner a's there is to jail a President who commits perjury or a President who ignores the Constitution by appointing federal officers who require Senate approval without such approval and while Congress is I'n session.

Which is to say, none. Thanks. Your non-response really shows the emptiness of this whole line of argument.

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Toyboy52 1 year, 1 month ago

@dusty: I would have responded sooner but the tears from the emptiness I feel inside rusted my I Phone. Such is the metaphor of my life as a lonely conservative seeking justice in a Democrat world.

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

MikeNC-- When folks here attack you, just remember: "Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it."-- Saul Alinsky, Rule 12, in "Rules for Radicals," 1971. You should feel honored, given how you are personally attacked here. Now get ready to hear from liberals who will claim they know nothing about Alinsky, his methods, his goals, etc. Better yet, enjoy those liberals who might admit they know of him but will try to tell us that Alinsky is the conservative's "Bogey-Man," and that no liberal today would ever follow Alinsky and his methods, etc. (and certainly not any of the liberals who are now attacking you now). Just watch. And enjoy the show. Be well!

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

Remind me; how long has Alinsky been dead?

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

Not long enough for you to have forgetten how to follow his instructions. (MikeNC-- This is the second type I referred to.)

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

And JimHeim, Karl Marx died about 90 years before Alinsky. That hasn't stopped liberals from following Marx, has it?

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buskwon 1 year, 1 month ago

When I was 26 years old I dropped a saltine cracker into a gallon of mustard , quite the dilemma , I was not sure if I should go in after it and get my hand covered in mustard or if I should just close the lid and hope the next time I open it I would not get a spoonful of soggy saltine mustard , well I thought for a second or two and just scooped the cracker out with a spoon . Now my hand is clean and I can still use the mustard.

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JER 1 year, 1 month ago

MikeNC: You know you are in deep doo doo when Thatcher has to start defending you. He is the patron saint of lost causes.

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

Thanks Thatcher. Yes, there is no reasoning or facts to be discussed any more. They ignore the facts placed right under their noses and answer with personal useless rhetoric, denial and drivel. They have become emboldened and see this as their time to move. They are about spin, denial, counter attack on baseless grounds and name calling, as that is all they have; while requesting civility for themselves. It must have taken JimHeim quite a bit to muster up the courage to spew his above words "but those of us who like this country". You LIKE this country? Most of you HATE this country and that will be your downfall. The more boisterous you become, the more of your HATRED for America is shown and most everyone who LOVES this country sees through your pitiful actions and LIES....Mike

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

Saul Alinsky is the GOP's real-life version of 1984's Emmanuel Goldstein. He's the one the Party trots out for the Two Minute Hate. He’s also become one of the favorite names to pull out of a hat when a wingnut is attempting to look smart to stupid people.

The “argument” if you can call it that without laughing, runs this way:

  1. Saul Alinsky was a radical “community organizer” who wrote a book on the subject called “Rules for Radicals.”

  2. Alinsky was a Marxist.

  3. Alinsky talked about changing organizations, not by trying to tear them down, but by changing them from within.

  4. Barack Obama got his start as a community organizer who studied and adopted the techniques set out in Alinsky’s book. Hillary Clinton wrote her thesis on Alinsky.

  5. Therefore. Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton are Marxists who seek to undermine America with a “secret agenda.” of Marxism.

The logical fallacy in this should be clear. It falls apart even further when you find out that organizations such as Dick Armey’s Freedomworks are handing out and studying Alinsky’s book sto its operatives to use in their own “community organizing.” Surely, no one would characterize Armey’s group as Marxist. Likewise, the Tea Partiers have also studied and implemented Alinsky-style tactics--one widely circulated TP memo urged supporters to “use the Alinsky playbook of which the left is so fond: Freeze it, attack it, personalize it, and polarize it..” No one would call them Marxist. So the illogical leap between (4) and (5), “studying and implementing Alinsky-style community organizing techniques means you’re a Marxist.” is destroyed.

Proposition (2) has already been demonstrated to be untrue, but the destruction of the “bridge” between (4) and (5) makes it irrelevant for purposes of any modern political discussion, since Alinsky died in 1972,

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

That hasn't stopped liberals from following Marx, has it?

This is called "begging the question". It's another logical fallacy.

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

Thatcher... "Now get ready to hear from liberals who will claim they know nothing about Alinsky, his methods, his goals, etc. Just watch. And enjoy the show. Enjoy those liberals who might admit they know of him but will try to tell us that Alinsky is the conservative's "Bogey-Man," and that no liberal today would ever follow Alinsky and his methods, etc."

You nailed it Thatcher. The carpet bombing has commenced....Mike

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

Another content free post from Miane. I guess pointing out logical fallacies is confusing for them, but they feel the need to respond. It's what you call a "+1": a post that really accomplishes nothing but adding to your post count.

Meanwhile, let's look at some of the things the candidate you're going to end up voting for has told bold-faced lies about:

When Obama took office, we were in a recession, and he made it worse. (The economy has improved steadily since he tool office).

When asked later how he could say that, he lied again and said, "I never said he made it worse."

I left the world of politics and went back into business. (He began his run for President a month after leaving the governorship.)

When I was asked if I wanted the Mass. health care plan to be used as an example for the country, Romney claims he said "no, it's just for Massachusetts." (He wrote an op-ed in USA today, telling Mr. Obama, in so many words, to learn from Massachusetts on health care reform. )

Health care reform will add a trillion dollars to the deficit. (Not according to any analysis...in fact the CBO still says it'll reduce the deficit.)

President Obama has doubled the deficit. (nope. Not even close).

President Obama hasn't signed any trade deals. (He's signed several).

They know they can't win by telling the truth, and winning, as they've said explicitly, is the only thing that matter to them, so they back the most shameless liar currently running.

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Guy_Forks 1 year, 1 month ago

Who's fault is it? Yours. You watch the news, see the corruption, and put it off to "just politics".

Seems to me maybe we should vote for someone other than just another politician. Maybe our neighbor...for congress...

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

Your comments have become meaningless Dusty. I would say that very few put any stock at all in what you say anymore. Many most likely ignore you and bypass your predictable written rants, hate and name calling. You hit an all time low several weeks ago which places you as a bottom feeder at best. Your comment I refer to is when you dove to the bottom of the barrel and attempted to use a handicapped / mentally challenged child to drive one of your political points. That was a disgrace..... To make it even worse you would not own up and apologise for it when Thatcher called you out on it. Others also rightfully commented to your post being despicable. Not only was there no apology for your disgusting words, but you doubled down and tried to reverse the table onto Thatcher being the bad guy. That goes below the bottom of the barrel.....Mike

dustyrhoades 1 month, 3 weeks ago ...Answering Mike and the three headed zombie troll is starting to feel like mocking the mentally challenged. And we all know Sarah Palin wouldn't like that.

Thatcher 1 month, 3 weeks ago ...DR, your comment about the Palin's son, Trig, is really disgusting and totally out of line. That child has never done anything to you. Maybe you should revise your remarks. I suspect you'll feel better when you do.

lakeview 1 month, 3 weeks ago I have a disabled child Dusty. You are the despicable one. You have no clue how ignorant you sound.

You then double downed . I was actually emnbarrassed for you. The whole text can be viewed at.... http://www.thepilot.com/news/2012/jan...

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

MikeNC-- Thanks for the nice comment. And DR, you have convinced me: given that Alinsky died in 1972 (and Marx in 1883) most liberals do not even know who they are, and thus would never employ their methods/ideology. For those liberals who do know of Marx and Alinsky, it is impossible for such liberals to now employ their methods/ideology because both Alinsky and Marx died long ago. I should have known this.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

Yes, please do view that thread, and if, unlike the proven liar MikeNC and lakeview/justmyopinion (yes they're the same person), you'll see I did nothing even resembling mocking a disabled child, but rather mocked Sarah Palin.

The fact that MikeNC has to trot that zombie lie out again, apropos of nothing, proves just how desperate he is and how little of substance he/she has to say. BTW, Miane, I see that, once again, you've decided not to try and defend your front-runner. But I know you'll still be voting for him, despite his track record of lies. Birds of a feather?

Thatcher, how about the fact that the Tea Party and Dick Armey's Freedomworks also study Alinsky?

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

How is it that I never heard of Alinsky until Newt brought him up? I guess I'll have to buy his book. Sure hope its on Kindle.

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

DR-- "Thatcher, how about the fact that the Tea Party and Dick Armey's Freedomworks also study Alinsky?" They study his organizational methods (which in many ways are highly effective). They do not agree with his ideology, unlike Obama, who studied and follows Alinsky in both methods AND ideology. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2249577/posts. You know this, DR, and before you quote Alinsky where he claims he is not a Marxist, remember he claims that even Marxists are not radical enough for him and his "independence." And JimHeim, "How is it that I never heard of Alinsky until Newt brought him up?" MikeNC, this is the first example to which I referred above. In all seriousness JimHeim, I think I actually believe you on this one.

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

DR and JimHeim-- Just some light reading to clear the air. http://news.investors.com/article/599154/201201261854/media-ignores-obama-alinsky-rules-for-radicals.htm. Really interesting stuff about your chosen one.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

before you quote Alinsky where he claims he is not a Marxist, remember he claims that even Marxists are not radical enough for him and his "independence."

Still means he's not a Marxist, Thatcher. But thanks for playing.

Oh, and citing a FreeRepublic article to prove Obama's a Marxist? That's like me quoting Michael Moore, and I give it about as much weight as anyone here would if I did that.

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

Dusty, Dusty, HO HUM BORING. Diane and Mike are one in the same. Mike Lies, Diane Lies. You're beginning to sound like a Chatty Cathy doll on the verge of a nervous breakdown. Seek Help. Diane

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

+1, Miane.

Still can't defend your presumptive nominee, I see.

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

DR-- "Still means he's (Alinsky's) not a Marxist, Thatcher. But thanks for playing." Because Alinsky believed Marxists did not go far enough and were too structured (thus violating Alinsky's supposed "independence"). Just curious DR: do you believe like Alinsky did that Marxists did not go far enough? Or do you believe the Marxists have gone far enough? I don't want to split hairs here, but who do you believe was right...Alinsky or orthodox Marxists?

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

Oh, and DR, since you don't like the FreeRepublic, here's some other light reading from cnsnews...perhaps a little more to your liking. http://cnsnews.com/news/article/white-house-sidesteps-question-obama-and-alinsky. I love America. What a great country. But again I'm curious DR...do you believe Alinsky loved America? Just let us know so we can post links back and forth. Thanks!

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

Dusty.I prefer Newt, but in the end, I'll gladly vote for Romney to BEAT Obama !! Diane ( Miane, what ever rocks your boat.)

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

Thatcher, since trying to start arguments over Saul Alinsky is a diversionary tactic the right uses to cover up the weakness of their candidate and the intellectual emptiness of their own positions, I really don't care. And you know what? Neither do the voters. Just like they didn't care about Bill Ayers, or Jeremiah Wright. You people beat all of those names to death during the election, and you lost anyway.

But please, do go on doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

I'll gladly vote for Romney to BEAT Obama !!

As I said. No principles at all. You'll vote for a guy who's supported the things you hate the most, just because he's not Obama. Just like the die-hard Democrats did for John Kerry. And lost.

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

DR-- I was not using any "diversionary tactics." I simply wanted to know whether you agreed with Alinsky, or orthodox Marxists. If you agree with one, or the other, or neither, please tell us why. Thanks.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

I'm going to assume that given the amazing diversions presented in this thread that there's no one here who can defend Mr. Levy's mistaken premise. Shows good sense. All conservatives here are aware of the free pass given Wall Street with their complex financial products. Excellent...

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

And remember DR, your own Moore County Democratic Chairman claims he only recently learned of Alinsky's existence. So help your readers out here. What do you believe?

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

[We have a fairly good idea of what the Democratic Chairman believes].

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

What do you believe?

If you haven't figured that out by now, there's really no hope for you.

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

Thanks DR! We thought we knew, but now we know.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

The sad thing about you, Thatcher, is that you really don't know how much you don't know.

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

Gotta wonder where Jim's been hiding at in Moore county, not to know anything about the patron saint of the how do you refer to yourselves now, Dusty "the progressive party"? Guess Jim doesn't know Hillary Clinton thinks Alinsky is the cat's meow. Jim, you really do need to catch up on your reading. AS for Dusty, well pegged him a long time ago. A Socialist at best. Diane

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

Thanks DR. This is what keeps me up late at night, not knowing what I don't know. My wife slaps me in the middle of the night and screams, "CONCENTRATE YOU IDIOT!" Seriously DR, I have nothing against you personally, and I believe you are a smart guy. I've defended you when others here have attacked you, and I've given you kudos for your funny columns (and they are pretty funny, regardless of politics). My disagreement with you is your use of foul language, and calling people names when they disagree with you. I would simply encourage you to try harder to be civil. Yes I know that others here have unfairly attacked you, too. I get that. But this tit-for-tat stuff is old. Start fresh. Discuss ideas. You are pretty good at that. Be well!

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MikeNC 1 year, 1 month ago

dustyrhoades 6 hours, 32 minutes ago ...Yes, please do view that thread, and you'll see I did nothing even resembling mocking a disabled child, but rather mocked Sarah Palin.

Those were YOUR words, no one else's. I gave you a chance to man up and do the right thing after several weeks of contemplation. You could have slept well tonight. But of course you remain arrogant. Where is your peanut gallery (JER, Moonchild and others) offering support on this issue? Even they know you crossed the line when using the handicapped to prop up your rhetoric....Mike

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

MikeNC, He's your patron saint, not mine. And until Newt brought his name up, you had no clue who he was either. Fess up.

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JER 1 year, 1 month ago

MikeNC: I see no reason to chime in on something that is only an "issue" in your hollow, cavernous skull (the one that was damaged by using it as a bump stop for your many heroic parachute jumps). But since I'm here, I'll simple confirm that any attack on Sara Palin is justified. She has made herself into an outspoken public figure in her quest for wealth and fame. She uses the conservatives as her "peanut gallery" to promote herself. She will never again be a candidate for anything. She is only interested in maintaining a public image, a steady flow of wealth into her bank account and she can do it by sitting on the sidelines being a wingnut cheerleader. I do give her credit for taking her meager talents and making the most of them. If we look into her family tree, we may find that she has some "Kardashian" in her DNA. Let me know if you would like for me to discuss my thoughts on Bristol, another nut that has not fallen far from the tree. This thread has to do with wingnuts trying to find someone, other than themselves, to blame for something. Try to stay on topic.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

MikeNC, the only person exploiting the handicapped here is you. You've got no argument to make, so you make stuff up.

Disgraceful.

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

DR-- Seems to me that you and MikeNC could agree that children of politicians are always off-limits, handicapped or otherwise. Once we agree on that, we could address the issues of the day, without name calling on either side. This includes MikeNC, you, and others here. To me, there are lots of smart folks on here. Debating the issues without the usual side-shows of personal attacks back and forth would be refreshing. Let's hope reason prevails. Be well!

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moonchild7 1 year, 1 month ago

From "The World That Never Was" (2010) by Alex Butterworth: "...was Marx's hope that the state would ultimately 'wither away' really any more hard-headed than the expectation of a spontanious revolution by the peasantry?....Surely what mattered most, was the practical means by which a society was moved in the right direction. And there was a genuine attempt to answer the question of how it was possible to be both truly democratic and act decisively by embracing collective responsibility and rigorous discipline." This is a quite interesting book about the Anarchists, Secret Agents, and Schemers from the late 19th Century who became revolutionaries and who changed the world. Mr. Butterworth writes about the similarities between then and now. He writes that Marx had a tremendously "monstrous ego" and it did not serve him well. He wrote this about Lenin: "Lenin bypassed the bourgeois stage of revolution the Marxist Dogma demanded, and progressed immediately to that of the workers and peasantry." So Thatcher, men have been behind all of these "movements" and have been making a mess of everything for too long now. Perhaps also Mr. Alinsky's idea's weren't quite right. Leaders of everything and anything these days seem corrupt and greedy. So where is the BEST answer? And who has it?

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JER 1 year, 1 month ago

Thatcher: I agree with your comment about bringing the children of political figures into the discussion....so long as those children do not interject themselves into the political discussion. They would also be fair game, in my opinion, if the politician used their children for political purposes. Therefore, I believe Bristol Palin is more than a fair target for discussion, just like the daughters of Gingrich and Cheney are fair game.

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JER 1 year, 1 month ago

Now let get back to the conservatives placing blame on the Obama administration for everything that has ever been wrong with this country. Next up, Isaneatorem's new TV ad showing what the country will look like if the President is re-elected. I think it's called "Obamaville". Coming soon to a TV near you. Be sure to not watch it alone or the boogeyman will get you.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

They would also be fair game, in my opinion, if the politician used their children for political purposes.

Which is exactly what I was making fun of, which Miane just couldn't resist lying about to desperately try and create a distraction, because s/he STILL can't come up with a coherent reason why s/he's going to vote for the guy who's supported everything s/he claims to hate, other than "he'll beat Obama."

"Conservative principles" has become an oxymoron.

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 1 month ago

So we have a current administration in Obamanation WHO CANNOT produce a balanced budget but now wants to control the health care for our entire country. HOW in the world is this going to be possible. The health care bill is already going to cost double of what Obama predicted.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

We don't need a balanced budget. We need to rev up our economy.

I missed afchief's impassioned letters during the Bush administration calling for a balanced budget; something Bush never even came close to, although he inherited one.

And the 'double' cost issue is a lie.It's only possible by using the data Republicans like and ignoring the numbers that prove them wrong. Tell the truth or lose the debate. It's that simple.

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 1 month ago

JIM HEIM HAS SPOKEN, here is the message plain and simple folks. The DEMS do not give squat about balancing a budget. JUST GIVE them more of your hard earned tax money to BLOW IT AWAY on companies like Solyndra. SUCK IT UP AND QUIT BLAMING BUSH!!!

OBAMA owns it and has MADE THE DEBT WORSE.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

The DEMS do not give squat about balancing a budget.

Neither did the REPUBLICANS under BUSH, and they won't if ROMNEY gets ELECTED.

SUCK IT UP AND QUIT BLAMING BUSH!!!

Republicans TALK A LOT about "ACCOUNTABILITY" but they're desperate to AVOID it THEMSELVES.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

Get real afchief, Reagan/Bush 1 tripled the national debt and Bush 2 doubled it. The only balanced budget in modern times was under a Democrat.

You can capitalize until the cows come home, but our side has the patent on fiscal responsibility.

Obama inherited a train wreck from a total incompetent and prevented a disastrous depression. Full recovery is going to take a while, since Republicans see their only hope as an America with a cratered economy and skyrocketing unemployment. But have patience; we're on the right track.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

Back on topic: it has now been four days since I asked the question:

Can you provide any legal authority for jailing Commissioners of Insurance or heads of other regulatory bodies for failing to regulate? Can you provide a citation from Chapter 58 that brings these particular instruments under the jurisdiction of the Department of Insurance?

Still no answer.

It seems our local GOP party chairman is, as I said earlier, full of overblown, irresponsible rhetoric.

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 1 month ago

Balanced budget was when the Repubs had control of the house and senate

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

afchief, you guys keep saying that but Bush had Republicans in charge of both houses for most of his time in the White House and he never came close. Care to try again?

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

JimHeim (7 hours, 12 min. ago)-- "We don't need a balanced budget. We need to rev up our economy." JimHeim (4 hours, 19 min. ago)-- "But our side has the patent on fiscal responsibility." Well.

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JimHeim 1 year, 1 month ago

If dad has a heart attack, will you refuse treatment because the cost would put the family's budget out of balance? Or would you pay the doctors to make him well so he can go back to work, repay the bill and keep the family afloat?

The fact remains that every Democratic president since Roosevelt has done better fiscally than every Republican president. And that's regardless of the party controlling Congress. We're still the fiscally responsible ones.

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Toyboy52 1 year, 1 month ago

@ Dusty: the problem with your inquiry about the Insurance Commissioner is that you ask what authority the Federal Government gives the states to regulate insurance. The true question is what authority the Federal Government has to regulate insurance. The truth is that Congress has no right under the Comstitration to pre-empt the field? The answer is that it does not, especially where credit default swaps also violate state "bucket shop" laws against fraud and gambling. And federal law cannot give immunity from state criminal law, including the licensing of insurance sales people.

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Toyboy52 1 year, 1 month ago

@ Dusty: the GOP Chairman.... Me... Never called you names. Why should you do so to him... Me. For instance, he never said your rhetoric was "Irresponsible" or "overblown" or even idiotic or stupid.I disagree with everyone who says you're idiotic. Of, course I could be wrong. But II will continue to defend your sanity no matter how many people disagree. With the humor we all need.... Bob Levy

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

JimHeim-- I think dad would have a heart attack if he learned about Obama's debt. http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-57400369-503544/national-debt-has-increased-more-under-obama-than-under-bush/. But no problem. Dad can take a "pain pill" under Obamacare. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z84hTR.... You and I appear to disagree on the meaning of the term "fiscal responsibility."

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

We might also disagree about the meaning of the 2010 "Summer of Recovery." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tNiC10.... Is this amazing recovery still going on in 2012? By the way, I like cats.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

@ Dusty: the problem with your inquiry about the Insurance Commissioner is that you ask what authority the Federal Government gives the states to regulate insurance. The true question is what authority the Federal Government has to regulate insurance.

That was not my question, and you know it. You're the one who said two insurance commissioners ought to be jailed for not regulating swaps, and I asked your legal authority for doing that. You still haven't answered that.

I also referred to your call that they be jailed and your rhetoric irresponsible, not you. But I guess the use of whining about name-calling to evade issues you can't answer comes right from the top.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 1 month ago

Saw this and immediately thought of our beloved AFCHIEF:

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Thatcher 1 year, 1 month ago

Now DR, remember that our favorite '60s protester on this site has a tendency to use all caps from time to time. I think she is smart. I also think she's often wrong. But she's still smart.

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 1 month ago

DR, I'm JUST FOLLOWING MC7s lead when it comes to using all CAPS. BUT I GUESS YOU DIDN'T NOTICE THAT SHE DOES THAT/

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