Rhetorical Letters

DaveyNC 10 months, 4 weeks ago

"The next election will be a choice of Obama for the majority of our citizens and Romney for the rich. "

Please. If anything, Obama is seeing to it that the biggest companies in the US are benefitting the most:

Too big to fail banks are even bigger and more protected from their own mistakes than ever.
Health insurers stand to gain a windfall thanks to the ACA.
Oil companies (yes, oil companies) are enjoying record earnings: http://goo.gl/Pf1pY (Language warning at that link)

I suppose when you stop to consider that all of those industries employ millions of people, your statement that Obama acts for the majority of our citizens could have some truth to it. But, given that you lefties think all evil in the world springs from corporations, how do you defend those three items I listed? However, the second part of your sentence cannot be defended in light of what Obama has actually done.

Ignore what politicians say, pay attention to what they actually do. They are rarely the same thing.

bufordsplay 10 months, 4 weeks ago

Wow parrots can not only talk......they can write letters to the Editor!! AMAZING!!

bufordsplay 10 months, 4 weeks ago

By the way Polly...you show me any place in the world where societies are not profit driven and you will see a society in decay....wake up and spit the kool aid out!

MikeNC 10 months, 4 weeks ago

Ron, You may want to re think the part on President Obama not having a majority in the House of Representatives and the Senate, and get back with us, okay? Oh and recession, two words: Frank and Dodd. Diane

JD 10 months, 4 weeks ago

President Obama not having a majority in the House of Representatives and the Senate, and get back with us, okay?

7months. And that is when the super majority was reintroduced. How about you quit using misinformation?

Oh and recession, two words:

No. 3 things actually: Commodity boom/ Housing bubble/ Inflation. And the housing bubble were people owning negative equity. Dodd/Frank was part, but not the entirety of the bubble event.

Now back to your regularly scheduled nonsense from Di-ke.

MikeNC 10 months, 4 weeks ago

JD, How bout you and Ron get it straight- 10 months the Democrats RULED this country, period ! Frank and Dodd, "Hey go buy a house, yeh, don't gotta put a dime down on it. Oh yeh, go ahead and refinance your house, take out a second mortgage and go buy a new car, and new furniture. Hell, don't worry you can't make the house payment." They CAUSED the bubble, which lead to this recession. 8 times Bush addressed this situation to the DEMOCRAT controlled congress and 8 times was told, "hey we got got it under control." And one last thing. If you choose to use the word DI-KE one more time in addressing me, I am going to ask the Pilot to remove your post. Diane

MikeNC 10 months, 4 weeks ago

Correction: 1 YEAR and 10 MONTHS. Diane

skylinefirepest 10 months, 4 weeks ago

Hey JD, I know it may be beyond your comprehension but how do you think Obamacare passed without a solid liberal majority????

Bentpan 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Ol Ron is obviously Dumb as a post, Example he points out, "The suggestion that Obama caused the financial crisis needs to be rebutted as the first sign of trouble came in July of 2007. " i guess he fails to understand Democrats held both houses with Obama being a Jr. Senator at the time. then this "gentleman" goes on to say" In the first two years of Obama’s term he did not have a super majority in either part of Congress; hence, his efforts were stymied by the opposition." as has already been pointed out this president did have a filibuster proof majority for almost 2 years when he lost it because even the voters in Mass. in replacing a Democrat ICON chose a TEA party member over the obvious heir apparent in an effort to stop the stupidity.Obama and The Demcrat party have proven to all but the most obtuse they are wastrels of our public treasure.

moonchild7 10 months, 3 weeks ago

When Corporations begin to use BLACKMAIL-TYPE tactics towards Government, then the "Government" needs to TAKE THEM OVER. Banks, Oil and Health Care deserve a FEDERAL TAKEOVER. I guess President Obama is thinking about the havoc it would create and the jobs that would be lost and so he has let them go on their way. We'll see what happens in his next term. He needs to turn the HEAT UP on them. He's been way too soft.

Spocks_Brain 10 months, 3 weeks ago

This letter is totally illogical-Obama has done nothing to create ANY jobs except some jobs at solar companies. What is the difference between the lay offs at these companies and any lay offs that may have occurred because of Bain Capital?
That said it would be a lot better for solar investments to be funded by Wall Street. Funneling funds to campaign contributors is totally illogical and nastier than anything Romney has ever done.

clarabelle 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Spocks_Brain - yes - I am sure you are correct........ not one job - shame shame shame........

and the far right loonies wonder why they are called that!

JD 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Correction: 1 YEAR and 10 MONTHS. Diane

still wrong

7 months.

This has been proven wrong time and time again. But you idiots keep saying it like its fact. I am so sad for you that the only internet website you can use is The Pilot. Learn to use Google. Heck just type in your dumb questions. They have been asked and answered. I'm not here to educate you Di-ke. Just here to prove you wrong. And I did.

Heck even the Daily Beast a conservative site says you are wrong. How much does it take to get through your thick head?

Pestilence can crawl away. I'm surprised you came out of your hole after the last time I embarrassed your ignorant self on these boards.

Spocks_Brain 10 months, 3 weeks ago

And why are we depending on politicians to create jobs anyway? Why is there such a thing as stimulus? Jobs are crested by the private sector. Any government jobs are basically ancillary. Why did Obama allow GM to avoid bankruptcy thus avoid treating all creditors equally? Fair? Ethical? This last fact alone is extremely illogical...so much for fairness and honesty.

Thatcher 10 months, 3 weeks ago

JD-- I'm curious: since you refer to Mike and Diane as "Di-ke," do you dislike gays, or instead think you are funny? Lots of folks here would like to know. Thanks.

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

JD, I'll be speaking with the editor tomorrow morning ! Ciao. Diane

Spocks_Brain 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Why are there no jobs? Would it be perhaps that up to 30 per cent of black males drop out of high school? Where is the black 'daddy'? How many of these drop outs turn out to be little rapper wannabees like the killers of Eve Carson? Could it be that the rap message is that its cooler to be a gangsta rather than be like 'Whitey? Where is Obama on this issue, or Holder???

Spocks_Brain 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Obama for the middle class? What about those 100 days he has golfed...I mean golf wipes out a day of work-he himself said he wouldnt rest a day...until the economy was restored. Instead he himself has shown no restraint in spending money, and no austerity whatsover, even in a small way, ie use of Air Force One....he is no example of anything

Thatcher 10 months, 3 weeks ago

MikeNC-- Mike and Diane, I can understand why you guys are upset about JD's posts. I would be too. But maybe give him a chance to apologize, fully, and if he refuses, do what you need to do and let the Pilot editors decide. I like your posts here, and would hate to see you stop posting here if folks who post vulgar comments are not banned. And JD, you are obviously a bright guy/gal, but here's a bit of advice: trying to out-do other liberals here to claim the mantle of "Most Vulgar, Yet Witty, Putdown," is not good. And you are not good at it. You would have alot to offer here if you stopped being so rude and vulgar. I don't want you banned, but I really hope you reconsider your posts here. Mike and Diane deserve an apology from you. Please give it some thought.

skylinefirepest 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Don't hold your breath waiting for an apology from JD, or clarybellie, or any of the others. When they can't come up with a good answer they simply resort to the name calling. I don't mind being called a pest...when I'm annoying the LEFT then I'm happy!!! And as to JD's last comment to me ...I have no idea what he's talking about as he has never embarrassed me on any matter. Usually when I spank him he simply resorts to name calling and whines. What, JD, what are you talking about my leftist opponent??

skylinefirepest 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Moonie, what are you talking about?? When the guvmint under your buddy the big O and his administration of mostly criminal cohorts starts trying to take over American businesses you're probably talking about armed revolt...we the people simply will not stand for it! Welcome, Spock's, to the comments. Your comments were well thought out and the lefties here can't stand that...they start calling you names shortly, simply because they can't, between them all, come up with an intelligent defense of Obammer and boys. You'll never get a good comment out of clarybellie, just name calling. She apparently cannot put an intelligent thought together to post. Dusty will give you an intelligent argument but he also has resorted to name calling after putting several good posts on here. JD and JimT will give you the occasional good thought but whatever you do don't let them know that you own firearms or they'll start accusing you of insurrection and try to get you barred from the Pilot. And Moonie, dear old moonie, is our comic relief...everything with her is the fault of industry and banking and the GOP. With the occasional comment about having worked for the guvmint for her whole life doing good and saving lives and improving the lifestyles of the rich and famous! But she's also a stated owner of firearms so I don't know why JD and Jimmy the T haven't gotten her banned....maybe it's because she is another leftie!

jimt 10 months, 3 weeks ago

AT the risk of repeating myself pest, frack you.

honesty2 10 months, 3 weeks ago

It seems the middle class will be bearing the brunt of O'tax per WSJ economist Stephen Moore. And as an independent, I am tired of the race/prejudice card being played when one simply disagrees with the potus' ideology and/or policies. Crying wolf is getting old.

Thatcher 10 months, 3 weeks ago

jimt-- Really? Someone like you would post something like that? Why? It is beneath you, and it is wrong.

jimt 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Where was your condemnation of pest's recent posts? You can't keep suggesting he and I are anything close to equivalent. He does nothing but insult and demean, that's all he's got.

In an earlier post he indicated he was "old." Good. The less time he's around the better.

clarabelle 10 months, 3 weeks ago

"skylinefullofpoop - Don't hold your breath waiting for an apology from JD, or clarybellie,"

You just may actually be dumber than buford........

Thatcher 10 months, 3 weeks ago

jimt-- I truly don't know what to say. Re-read your last line. That is uncalled for, and I hope you know so. You can post so much better. And you have, especially when you were not holding a grudge.

JD 10 months, 3 weeks ago

JD, I'll be speaking with the editor tomorrow morning ! Will you be asking the editor about how you were wrong Di-ke?

JD-- I'm curious: since you refer to Mike and Diane as "Di-ke," do you dislike gays, or instead think you are funny? Lots of folks here would like to know. Thanks. trying to out-do other liberals here to claim the mantle of "Most Vulgar, Yet Witty, Putdown," Thatcher stop it. You are not anything but an old troll to these boards. You and your ilk constantly ignore facts and just cause vitriol. Out do a lib? Am I lib? Not according to my voter registry. I just don't like you hijackers in my party. People like you ran out Gary Johnson and respectable conservatives. Enjoy Jindal, Gingrich, Rove and all your other heroes. Maggie would not approve of you. Di-ke= Diane and Mike. They share an account and post in inane ways, so I just shortened it. Your welcome and try another red herring.'

Cry some more children. You try and take a moral high ground when you are just bottom feeding trolls. This is especially true with Pestilence. I proved you wrong on your super majority nonsense and now you want to make it personal? That should remind you of the last thread I tanned your hide Pestilence. Insult, whine, and accuse the other guy of your own actions. I got your ticket baby boy.

Try again trololo's.

JD 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Spocks_Brain 4 hours, 2 minutes ago Why are there no jobs?

Ask John Boehner.

As for the rest of your post, it's just nonsense.

skylinefirepest 10 months, 3 weeks ago

See Spock? Just like I said. ..when the going gets tough the "tough" start calling names since they can't give an intelligent answer. I still can't figure what JD thinks he got the better of me on! Super majority? I've spanked you on so much stuff, JD, that you'll have to give me a better hint than that. Jimt...if you dare to frack me, young man, you'll get gas!! Wasn't that what you were looking for??? JD, last thread you tanned my hide??? What are you talking about, dude?? I didn't know anyone was keeping score but I guess you still come out as a LOSER, no matter.

JD 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Pestilence

Just keep violating those terms of service. So much whining and name calling. Can't wait for you to get yourself banned.

Spock (and I use that lightly) made a bunch of random questions to the gist of the plight of African American and attributed it (poorly) to somehow being President Obama and Eric Holders fault. It's like Bob Levy made another account besides Toytime. It's dumb, like you Pest.

jimt 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Thatcher, still waiting for your explicit condemnation of pest. Pest is the kind of bully who would argue to an adult that the fight started when the other person hit him back.

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Thatcher: I would not ever asked anyone be banned.I simply want JD to refer to me as Diane. I've never slammed anyone's usersname. After I made my post here last night asking JD not to refer to me as Di-ke, he went ahead and used it again on the gas price column. JD: I didn't make it personal. Diane

BigE 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Diane- I get you are a Republican. I get you dislike liberals. I take it you hate Obama for a whole host of reasons. Fair enough, those are your rights, but if you want to have any credibility you have got to stop repeating nonsense. Every president of my lifetime has pushed for affordable housing and home ownership including Ronald Reagan and George Bush! The facts are the vast majority (>85%) of non-conforming mortgages were sold by banks not covered under the act you like referring to. The crisis had many contributors including CAPITALISM . Repeating your Dodds/Frank mantra is childish. The bubble was aided by lots of things- low interests & easy credit, fraudulent underwriting, predatory lending, deregulation, shadow banking, innovative and complex financial instruments. Who profited more from poor people getting mortgages they couldn't afford the politicians or the bankers? (I'll give you a hint, they have mansions in the tri-state area of NJ/NY/CT.) Want to forward your cause and make America a better place (That's the goal isn't it?), stop blindly following an ideology and solicit input from more balanced sources. Don't allow yourself to be so easily manipulated.

OldSpook 10 months, 3 weeks ago

jimt - "is the kind of bully who would argue to an adult that the fight started when the other person hit him back."

That is about the best slam I have read on this blog site. Excellant use of twisted logic to make a point, I had to read it twice. Thanks for the clever twist and a good laugh.

JD 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Diane you make outrageous statements and then produce red herring arguments when you are called out on your incorrect information. You act as if you know what you are talking about. Things like, "How bout you and Ron get it straight" just let me know you are not prepared to back up your comments. I don't take talking points like you and need not confer with someone else. I showed you up and now you want to go tattle to the editor that I hurt your widdle feelings. Like the Pilot cares what you think. They make money every time we post. Heck they make more off this than the paper ads.

Grow up and get your own account like a big girl then I can call you and Mike out on misinformation.

jimt 10 months, 3 weeks ago

OldSpook,

You're welcom, I think.

Sadly, people like pest are no joke.

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

BigE: First off, I don't hate liberals and I don't hate the President. I do not agree at all with their ideology. They prefer socialism, I prefer captitalism. Many (not all banks ) Banks were "very much encouraged" to give poor people loans. Acorn, as one example of being an encoourager. Bottom dollar, back in Reagan's day, when Mike and I went to buy a home, we still had to list all of our assests as well as liabilities and income. We then had to put down at least 10% of the total mortgage, 20% to avoid having to buy insurance if we did not make payments. We also were given a booklet of various loans available. The banker then read thru the contract with us. It was up to US, not the banks, to decide if we were going to agree to the contract and sign on the dotted line.A bank can come up with any contract or rate and terms they desire. It's up to the individual to decide to take it or walk away from it. If I walk into a car dealership wanting an Escort and driving away in a Cadillac because the salesmen "talked me into it." It's my fault. AS for Barney Frank, I stand by my statement. Barney Frank led the charge into this recession. Diane

Timeline shows Bush, McCain warning Dems of financial and housing crisis; meltdown by ProudToBeCanadian

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Big E: One more thing. I will repeat myself, as I've done on occassion. I use to be a strong Liberal. Pretty hard to grow up in the late 60s, 10 miles from Kent State, and not be a Liberal. My grandfather, on my father's side, was a strong Socialist/ Communist. He had traveled Russian extensively during the first revolution, before coming to the U S. He was a strong Union organizer with the Lathe operators, in the 30s and 40s. When he died in 1964, a huge crowd of Socialist and Communist memebers of the Slovenian community in Cleveland came to his wake and presented us with a Slovenian ediotrial they written about Augusta Kuznik and transcribed it into English for us. My conversion did not happen over night. Took about 3 years for me to finally step back, and review and re think my political position. and I'm happy I did. Diane

pinewoodnc 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Mr. VanHoover, you need to go back and read the history of the last three plus years! Also, Obama does nothing but pander to the rich and famous (Parker's big party). The man will do or say anything to get elected or attract certain (example: Hispanic) voters no matter how wishy washy he looks. The man has no backbone and will never stand up for his own ethics or beliefs unless he feels they will get him elected. A spineless wonder!!!

BigE 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Diane- Do you get that a person can value a role for government (larger than you personally would like) and still not be a Socialist? I agree every individual should be accountable for their own decisions, thus every American in a bad mortgage situation shares the blame, but then every capitalist involved in fraud, cheating, unethical behavior should also be accountable, no? Do you not believe in any consumer protections? Is the America you desire to live in one where we should just have a free for all and allow the weak, uneducated, and dumb to be taken advantage of? Do you not understand that financial entities needed to sell mortgages for their mortgage backed financial instruments and didn't care about anything other than their commissions and that had nothing to do with Barney Frank? Do you get the mess had many mothers and fathers of all political persuasions? So regardless of the facts, "you stand by your statement?" Do you understand that Americans used the growing equity in their homes, generated by the bubble, as income to buy goods and services? Do you understand that "income" no longer exists for many Americans and thus demand is down and employment is down? Do you get that as the stimulus money runs out and that states let go of teachers etc, unemployment will rise? Do you get that government income is down, i.e. taxes? Do you understand that the year over year change in to total government spending (local, state, and federal) per capita has dropped the greatest % amount in one year since the end of the Korean War? Do you get that not every poor person wants to be poor and get government assistance? Do you get that as America continues to lose its meritocracy that wealth shifts from the many to the few and the social fabric of the country you love gets shattered? Do you get that the Republican party wanted no part in improving the economy under Obama because their objective wasn't about helping America and Americans, it was about power and getting that Democrat out of the White House? I am not saying Frank is blameless, I am saying he is such a very small piece of the blame pie, anyone focused on him doesn't really care to know the cause, the effects, or the solutions. Sadly, they just want to vent hate.

clarabelle 10 months, 3 weeks ago

"pinewoodnc - Mr. VanHoover, you need to go back and read the history of the last three plus years! Also, Obama does nothing but pander to the rich and famous (Parker's big party)."

Sounds just like skyline_fire_poops" dumber (never thought I would say that) brother.......

And talk about the Grand Poobah of pandering - ol mitt romney himself.

Unreal - the ignorant rants of the far right!

skylinefirepest 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Clarabelle...have you ever posted in the Pilot with an intelligent comment?? Without calling names? Is that all you can do?? JD...grow up and get a set of you know what, how about?? Diane has asked you to not use that name and you are seemingly too childish to comply. Be a man for once and be polite. I do know that is asking a lot of you per our little disagreements on issues but will you try to be a gentleman when asked??

Thatcher 10 months, 3 weeks ago

jimt (9 hours, 34 min. ago)-- "Thatcher, still waiting for your explicit condemnation of pest." I did exactly that on an earlier thread, in which I told him that his comments were out of bounds, and that he should apologize to you, and you to him for your posts. I urged both of you to forget the past bad-blood, and start fresh. You know this, jimt. I am not the referee on this site. I can only urge folks to be more civil...which I have done many times. You and skylinefirepest have a long history here, which apparently pre-dates my arrival to this site. I don't have the ability to control what either one of you decides to post about the other. You both are obviously very intelligent, and I hope your intelligence will prevail over name-calling. For what it's worth, there are (in my opinion) three liberals here whose posts I look forward to reading (when they are devoid of name calling): yours, DR's, and JER's. Not because I agree with you, but because the posts are usually well-reasoned and can lead to a productive debate of the issue at hand. Name calling, in my view, stifles all debate. I've said this before, and I believe it to be true: there are many liberal posters here who try to be like you, DR, and JER, but they seem to lack your intelligence, wit, and cleverness. And they also lack your fairness. Hence, I'm now labeled an "old troll" by folks who, presumably, don't even know what a troll is, and who wouldn't know the difference between marginal tax rates and a strip club in Vegas. I have been fair to you, and you to me. And that will continue. Cheers!

skylinefirepest 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Got a question for the far leftist leaners here...to paraphrase a question I heard recently...will you diehard prostrated before your idol in supplication liberals ever get tired of Obama lying to YOU as well as the rest of the country??? He's still running around on our dollars saying that his plan was not a tax...well, it's either a tax or it's UNCONSTITUTIONAL per the Supreme Court. While he and his" loaded with people you wouldn't normally associate with on the street" administration have raised our debt limit and piled another five trillion dollars on YOUR children and grandchildren Jimmy Heim is still saying he didn't spend enough of our money. And I'll remind you that YOU wouldn't spend your money that way, especially while borrowing forty percent of it. Defend that? Can't be done by any sensible person!

clarabelle 10 months, 3 weeks ago

"skylinefirepest - Clarabelle...have you ever posted in the Pilot with an intelligent comment?? Without calling names? "

I wonder - if you ever really read (or perhaps the nurse at the home reads it to you) any of the posts from the liberal minded here.

And after reading a few of your posts........ I wonder if you could even identify an intelligent post.

Finally.......... get some tissue and wipe those blood shot eyes of yours......... the SCOTUS has made its decision......... act like a man (albeit an old codgery one) already.......... :)

btw - the answer is "no" ............although I really tried!

jimt 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Thatcher, I thank you for your kind words towards me, but this sticks in my craw, re: me and pest, "You both are obviously very intelligent...," Pest never to my memory has ever posted anything well reasoned and absent of malice. All he does is attack, belittle, self-promote, and lie. he never supplies sources, and when challenged to do so, won't. When you find sources that contradict him on facts, he never assesses your response, just attacks some more.

I think you should add BigE to your list of more liberal posters who you admire. His recent posting putting down the, as usual, simplistic right-wing noise machine on Frank/Dodd being responsible for the housing bust as parroted by Diane is priceless.

BigE, will Diane "get it?" NO.

Thatcher 10 months, 3 weeks ago

You are more than welcome, jimt. For now, I will keep my "liberals I admire" list as is. Cheers!

skylinefirepest 10 months, 3 weeks ago

JimT...I've said repeatedly that I will NOT do your research for you. If you and others think it's wise to spend money we don't have then I can't educate you. I'll bet you don't let your wife spend money that includes forty percent borrowed??? The last little round we had I explained the one item that was not very thoroughly covered by the liberal leaning mass media. The rest of it was well covered in newspapers and tv. Oh, and I did apologize for saying that you were a good argument for abortion. AS I SAID...if you don't watch and read the news then that's your bad, not mine. I absolutely do recognize an intelligent comment when I see one and I respect Dusty because his comments are thoroughly researched. I don't always agree with Dusty but as long as he's not calling names and such I read his stuff and can appreciate his point of view. Not so with you and JD and Clarabelle because you tend to name call and say that people lie and are stupid and that just makes y'all look bad.

skylinefirepest 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Clarabelle you missed the point...of course the Supreme Court passed it...I'm well aware of it and I agree with Roberts when he said the court is not responsible for correcting BAD LAW!! But Roberts upheld because he said it was a TAX and your man Obama is still running around saying it's NOT A TAX....that in my book is a lie! Even Pelosi slipped up the other day and called it a tax. So what is it? A tax, which makes it Constitutional, or a penalty, not a tax, which makes it NOT Constitutional? What's your take on it? Obama lying again? Which I presume from your last comment that you don't mind.

moonchild7 10 months, 3 weeks ago

BigE, thanks so much for your absolutely great comment. Bravo. And MikeNC "Diane" that was quite a revealing piece that you wrote. I am quite astonished and also have a bit more respect for you. The only question I ask is what made your drastic "turn" against your families past political history? Even though you state that it took several years, there must have been one real "eye opening event" that made you become a Conservative. I don't ask this to ridicule you, just interested.

Thatcher 10 months, 3 weeks ago

MC7-- I've commented here before about your posts involving your son. Great posts. Your last post ranks right up there. Good for you! Cheers!

dustyrhoades 10 months, 3 weeks ago

But Roberts upheld because he said it was a TAX and your man Obama is still running around saying it's NOT A TAX....that in my book is a lie!

Then Romney's a liar as well.

*A top strategist for Mitt Romney indicated today the presumptive GOP nominee agrees with President Obama that the mandate most Americans obtain health insurance is not a tax, as the Supreme Court ruled last week.

"The governor believes that what we put in place in Massachusetts was a penalty and he disagrees with the court's ruling that the mandate was a tax," Fehrnstrom said on MSNBC's The Daily Rundown.

Asked by MSNBC's Chuck Todd if Romney agrees with Obama "that you should not call the tax penalty a tax, you should call it a penalty or a fee or a fine," Fehrnstrom responded: "That's correct."*

Still voting for him? Even though, by your own admission, he's a liar?

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/onpolitics/post/2012/07/mitt-romney-health-care-penalty-tax-eric-fehrnstrom/1

dustyrhoades 10 months, 3 weeks ago

I am LOVING THIS. Romney's in an impossible hole he dug for himself. If he calls the mandate a "tax", he's admitting he raised taxes. If he doesn't, he alienates the base, distances himself from his party's Congressional leadership, and makes it look like the whole party's in disarray.

Delicious. Absolutely delicious. The perfect fate for the pandering , principle-free Mitt "Etch a Sketch" Romney.

jimt 10 months, 3 weeks ago

pest: "JimT...I've said repeatedly that I will NOT do your research for you."

Said another way, I can say anything I want because to me it's the truth and I don't have to indicate the source(s) of my information.

This guy should just be IGNORED until he starts providing source citations and links.

Can you imagine pest's attitude and hubris elsewhere? Doctor's don't have to provide lab results, we just trust them. Lawyers don't have to cite caselaw to support their arguments. Academics don't have to use footnotes in papers they publish.

So as far as I'm concerned pest is a proven liar until he proves otherwise. Put another way: How do we know when pest is lying? When he's typing.

dustyrhoades 10 months, 3 weeks ago

I can't wait for pesty to try to explain this one away. If, as he says, saying the mandate isn't a tax is lying, then Romney, who says it isn't a tax, is a liar. But pesty's voting for him. But he's a liar, and pesty claims to not like liars. I think it'll end up something like the scene from Star Trek where Kirk traps the robots in a loop of illogic till their brains fry...

Capt. Kirk talks a robot to death by Joe Knapp

jimt 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Dusty, It's easy for pest. He seems to suffer a classic psychological disorder called cognitive dissonance, defined as:

Cognitive dissonance is a discomfort caused by holding conflicting cognitions (e.g., ideas, beliefs, values, emotional reactions) simultaneously. In a state of dissonance, people may feel surprise, dread, guilt, anger, or embarrassment. Source: Festinger, L. (1957). A theory of cognitive dissonance. Stanford, CA: Stanford University Press.

Dread fits, he's scared and paranoid about us "lefties." Guilt, don't think so, you have to be capable of remorse and know the difference between truth and fiction -- don't think pest fits this characteristic. Anger, in spades, he spews anger with every post when it's directed at us "lefties." Embarrassment, nope, you must be able to be somewhat self-reflective and recognize that you've stepped over social norms and mores, or done something that brings ridicule upon yourself, which you yourself then recognize as having done so. That degree of self-awareness is way, way beyond pest's abilities.

skylinefirepest 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Dusty...not a problem...I've already said that I don't like Romney...BUT, I HATE OBAMA for what he has done to this country. So yes, conflicting feelings and voting for the lesser of two evils. Satisfied? I don't like liars and JimT is apparently one of the biggest on the comment line at the Pilot. He got on my bad side by falsely accusing me of threatening you, of all people, when I wrote a comment about how you and I would run the White House better than Obama. Most everything else he has written about me since has been derogatory and more than quite a few lies. You'll notice that in his last post he accuses me of lying again because I won't cater to his orders. Well, JimT, Oh ye of little intelligence and even greater forked tongue, you can KMRRA. I don't cater to your whims...everything I post can be easily established even by someone of your supposedly limited mental capacity. Common knowledge is usually accepted as source when it has appeared repeatedly in the media. So I guess, once again, that you can't or don't read or watch the news! You say "in your opinion" that I'm a liar...well opinions are like you know what and you have your head stuck up yours so look for the opinion while you're in there. To put it mildly your posts are generally garbage and I presume your political views are also. I really can't think of why anyone with any sense, with any love of country, with a job even , would vote for the incompetent liar we have now as our supreme leader. November will tell the tale.

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Moonchild: This is straight from the heart and I'm serious as a heart attack. The Abortion issue and the Smoot Hawley Act. I was always pro choice, until I spoke with a lady one day in her 80s. She posed a question to me, and I couldn't answer it.) Then one time of the hundreds of times Mike and I are on the road to Ohio. You can only listen to so many top 40 radio stations and CDs for almost 700 miles. Mike says wanna listen to Rush? I said are you kidding that @#$^hole. (and I'm being kind, because I had a few other choice nouns to express my feelings about Rush.)Next thing you know I'm hearing the guitar licks of Chrissy Hines "where'd you go to Ohio" and Rush starts in. His topic, The Great Depression. He says here's what you were probably told how it came about. And I'm thinkin yeh, that's what I was told. Then he brought up Smoot Hawley, and I checked him out on it. He was right. Smoot Hawley Act brought the walls down. After that, I start listening a bit more and a bit more and here I am. I guess I was converted much as Andrew Breibart was. Diane

JD 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Pestilence just shows it's anybody but Obama in his book. But rather than look at other candidates, like Gary Johnson, he jumps to someone who is a known bully and jerk like Romney. Angry birds of a feather.

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Big E: Tell me which country whose people allows it's government to control more and more of the peoples wealth and earnings, hence more control over their lives and is not socialistic in nature?
As to the ill informed home buyers. If you were in that car dealership when I was there to buy the Escort and you heard the sales man doing his sales pitch on me about buying the Caddy, what would you of done? Would you of butted in or left it alone? As for taxes- gotta quote Jefferson: I predict future happiness for Americans, if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of "taking care of them." Diane

dustyrhoades 10 months, 3 weeks ago

I don't like Romney...BUT, I HATE OBAMA

But...but...I thought it was the liberals who were filled with hate!

At least pesty is honest about it, unlike some.

So much hate and bitterness and paranoia. I'd pity them if they weren't such tools about it.

As for Romney saying it is not a tax law, well he says that so that the law could not be upheld as constitutional.

Actually, if he calls it a tax, then he has to admit he raised taxes in Massachusetts. At least he would have to if he was honest and not a weasel. This may very well be the flip flop that breaks the back of his candidacy. He can't run from it any more.

So, wdd: did Romney raise taxes in Mass. or didn't he? And how can you vote for a guy who raised taxes?

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Yep...twist it all onto Romney. There is more explaining to be done by others as well. This "Tax vs Penalty" thing is a fine example of how liberals will behave when they are unconditionally caved in to. Why cannot people just call things truthfully for what they are and do things that benefit our country and damn all the political allegience and ideology. ....Mike

President Obama in 2009: Mandate is Not a Tax by ABCNews

skylinefirepest 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Actually JD I agree with you again. But the choice in November is Obama vs. Romney. Another candidate doesn't stand a snowball's chance. So yes, it's Romney. Dusty, when you say so filled with hate you're not talking about me. I say I hate Obama and it's rhetorical. The man himself I could absolutely care less about...it's his policies and what he has done to this country, the best on the face of the earth and he's done his best to lower us to third world status.

dustyrhoades 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Yep...twist it all onto Romney.

Hey, he's YOUR candidate.

So Mike, did Romney raise taxes or didn't he?

rightwingpatriot 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Dusty im just going out on a limb here but your a liberal nutjob. that is all

JD 10 months, 3 weeks ago

and what he has done to this country, the best on the face of the earth and he's done his best to lower us to third world status.

What?

Tin foil hat on Yes it was all the President! He has sole responsibilty. Where are the jobs Mr. Boehner? Wait Obama is hiding them. Because if the President makes jobs, he is making government bigger. If they help out an industry, they are taking over the industry!

Tin foil hat off

What do you want the man to do besides just become a puppet for neo con Republican policies?

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Dusty, then both candidates can be in for "a lotta explainin" to do. As both are now flip flopping on the tax penalty mandate, right? Diane

OldSpook 10 months, 3 weeks ago

JD, While I know the question is not directed to me, I offer one small answer.

Cal Recycle says turning tires into asphalt is no more environmentally unfriendly than the current method of making asphalt and it has a number of benefits. “They kind of lay it over the top of the road that’s already there in a thin overlay, maybe like one or two inches. So, it preserves the pavement that’s there. It’s quieter than your regular, traditional road surface. It also stays black longer, so the striping is more visible, so there’s a safety component," said Jones.

Perhaps if the President were to provide incentive's for small companies (upstarts) to provide this type of innovative service this country could rebuild itself, literally in this case.

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

dustyrhoades 47 minutes ago ....Hey, he's YOUR candidate...So Mike, did Romney raise taxes or didn't he?

So Dusty, did Obama raise taxes or didn't he? I agree with Diane. They both have some splaining' to do. With Romney's 70 page bill vs 2,000+ plus pages and all the unkowns yet to be figured out with Obama care, I'm thinking Obama's version will do a much heartier job of raising folks taxes if that's the intention. I saw Pelosi's most interesting response to this question on Meet the Press...Mike

Nancy Pelosi - "It's not a tax" ... it's a taaa....oops by RuBegonia

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Dusty I've posed this question before and I'll do so again: Does everyone who believes in this new healthcare law that the 20 plus new taxes within it and the revenue it creates, will go soley to implementing this law,and providing healthcare or do you possibly foresee some of this money being diverted and used for other government programs, as in the case of social security? Diane

Arestorer 10 months, 3 weeks ago

"the best on the face of the earth and he's done his best to lower us to third world status."

Just a comment here,,,"One World Economy" did not come from this administration........ Did you all really think that the rest of the world was going to raise themselves up to US standards??? Think not!!! The US was lowered by being involved in this crock...

Arestorer 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Diane; I dont think the government holds these funds in individual accounts.....Thou, they probably should,especially SSI.

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Arestorer: I had forgotten, until I heard it mentioned today: for two years the 20 plus new taxes will be collected before all of the new Healthcare law is implemented. I'm thinking that for two years our government will squirrel all this revenue away til then? I'm willing to bet the store, some if not most of the revenue will be gone when fully implemented and then what? I'm afraid the answer will be "more taxes." Plus How does the govenment deplete Medicare half a trilion and and the same time put an additional 7 plus Million people into it and then also have to address doc fix? We need to address health care costs, but this new law, ain't it. I am for coverage with pre existing conditions and I do like kids on parent's programs until 26 or whatever it is. but that's it.Scrap the rest and start over. Diane

Courseaire 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Old Demokrat's Moniker: Tax & Spend
New Demokrat Moniker: Spent, Tax & Spend

moonchild7 10 months, 3 weeks ago

It really doesn't matter what it's called. This is the same Health Care Plan that was implemented in Massachusettes and the citizens there LOVE it. They don't seem to mind what it's called or if they have to pay a "Penalty Tax", I guess they pay it. Case closed. I don't like paying taxes any more than the rest of you but I pay them. I own two homes (one income producing) so I have to pay Moore Co., Property Taxes on both of them. Several years ago when I sold other Income Producing Properties i had to pay an unbelievable amount of Capital Gains Taxes because of the "Profit" that I made. That's life and taxes are just a part of it. I make due as everyone should. I don't live beyond my means even though yes, I'd love a few more "Luxuries" considering I think I have very few. Three cars and two trucks which I have to pay Moore Co., MORE taxes on; but they're all older and paid for. Thanks Diane for your response. I do respect you so much more for answering me with such honesty. I had never heard of the Smoot-Hawley Act and had to read up on it; and I don't quite understand how it changed your "politics." After WW I Europe OWED us BILLIONS. But Germany defaulted on it's debt's and it took years and years for all of those countries to repay us...and AFTER WW II. We rebuilt them? Actually everything considered, The WORLD OWES US SO MUCH MONEY IT"S JUST NOT FUNNY. All of this Debt mess is a sick JOKE. Oh and thanks Thatcher: but I get really "worked up" with I guess MEAN NAME CALLING RHETORIC when a lot of CRAZY talk gets going. I'll have another more decent "story" about my son later.

Thatcher 10 months, 3 weeks ago

MC7-- You are more than welcome, and I look forward to reading it. Thanks.

MikeNC 10 months, 3 weeks ago

Long story short, Moonchild, during the Depression people began to think it would be a good idea to impose heavy import taxes (Smoot Hawley Act) with the idea, "it would make people buy only here and therefore increase jobs due to productivity." It proved disasterous and unemployment went thru the roof. Smoot Hawley Act was foundation for me to dig deeper into the philosphy of continually imposing new taxes. AS for Germany, the League of Nations put such erroneous penalties on Germany after WW I, Germany went into a recession with Inflation doubling by the week until Germans said Enough, and out of that disaster, rose Hitler. Diane

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