Two Clunkers by Obama Defeat From the Jaws of Victory?

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As George Washington Plunkett, denizen of Tammany Hall, famously said, “Politics ain’t beanbag.” Indeed it ain’t.

An election year that was beginning to look like a long, tedious march toward the re-election of Barack Obama has at least become more interesting, if not substantially changed. In just the past few days, the president has made a couple of remarkable blunders with no assistance at all from his opponents.

First, he rejected the Keystone pipeline as a sop to his environmentalist constituency. This was incomprehensibly tone-deaf. First, the pipeline would have created somewhere between 20,000 and 100,000 jobs, depending on whose numbers you believe.

Perhaps more important, the decision is counterproductive to the environmentalist cause. Canada is going to produce the oil by fracking, whether we like it or not; then, instead of shipping it through a nice, clean pipeline to our relatively clean refineries, it will be shipped to dirty Chinese refineries in oil-burning tankers, many of which will have single hulls — the kind that spill oil everywhere if damaged.

This decision has aggravated unions, conservatives and anyone unhappy with our dependence on Mideastern oil, all at once.

Then there’s the enormous recent flap over the directive that Catholic institutions include access to means of contraception in their health care plans. This has riled not only Catholics, who believe it violates a basic tenet of their faith and the constitutionally guaranteed separation of church and state, but also conservatives and anyone else concerned about the intrusiveness of the federal government.

It is also viewed by many as a first step toward eventually including abortion in health care services. Many people with no qualms about contraception or abortion are resentful of this action.

This debate has taken off in a way that was clearly unanticipated, and the administration is struggling to calm the waters with doubletalk about compromise.

Even with the election nine months away, these decisions will remain as issues.

Then there are the Republicans. Suddenly, pretty much out of nowhere, Rick Santorum won primary events in Colorado, Minnesota and Missouri. The anyone-but-Romney forces arose once again, and only time will tell if Santorum will go the way of Bachmann, Cain, Perry and possibly Gingrich, or whether he can reinvigorate his campaign and fundraising efforts. Santorum, by the way, is a Catholic.

All of this has taken over the news in a week following a good employment report, a week the administration would have liked to spend trumpeting improving economic news. That opportunity is essentially gone; by the time the news cycle calms down, the employment report will be ancient history.

In our interminable — or perhaps I should say permanent — election process, every event becomes political; there is no relief. That is why, with nine months to go, anything could still happen. In addition to the issues of the past few weeks, we still have overhanging us the payroll tax debate, the budget, the deficit and, on the international front, the European financial crisis, Afghanistan, Iran and more.

All these things are clearly in view, and for the most part, cannot be sidestepped. The president, as well as his eventual opponent, will have to do or say something about them. No matter how much they may wish to obfuscate the issues, they will not go away; and somehow, in light of all of this, next November we have to choose a president, and a lot of other people, to manage the government.

The course of the election may or may not be altered by any of these events, but they at least demonstrate that as someone, probably Yogi, said, “It ain’t over till it’s over.”

Fred Wolferman lives in Southern Pines. Contact him by email at fwolferman@

sbcglobal.net.

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Comments

JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

A few things Mr Wolferman apparently doesn’t know: 1. Congress required the president to sign off on a project on a quick timetable without giving him the authority to waive the decades of environmental laws that must be complied with. 2. The route of the pipeline is yet to be determined? The people of Nebraska voted to prohibit the pipeline in their state. I’m sure you back them what with state’s rights and all. 3. The oil would go from Canada to a tax-free zone in Texas to be refines and shipped to China. Where is the benefit for us? 4. Re-routing the current pipe from the Midwest to Texas would reduce the supply of gasoline in the Midwest and cause a price rise. How does that benefit us? 5. 98% of sexually-active Catholic women use birth control methods the Church does not approve of. Where would the government get off forcing those women to violate their own values to conform to their employer’s? 6. With the president’s compromise, women get their contraceptives and the GOP war on women will have to look somewhere else.

If choir boys got pregnant, these bishops would be first in line to buy birth control pills.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 3 months ago

If choir boys got pregnant, these bishops would be first in line to buy birth control pills.

Zing!

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CC85 1 year, 3 months ago

The majority of employee's at Catholic sponsored and/or founded companies are not Catholic. One scare tactic I've seen from local Bishop's is the option to not "offer health insurance" to employee's. Reality is that decision is not within their power in regards to a Faith based organziation that does not receive funding from the Church.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Jim as a Catholic I find your last line pathetic, disgusting and something that an Official with the Local Democrat Party and spokesman for that organization should know better than to submit. Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

CC85 where did you read or hear about the 'scare tactic" that the bishops are using? I'd like to read it. Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

So should I assume that there is now an all out assault by Democrats to demean the Catholic Faith and their followers? I mean I've gotten over being called a Bigot, A racist, and Crazy, but now the faith I follow is also wrong within the eyes of the Democat Party? Diane

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CC85 1 year, 3 months ago

"Unless the rule is overturned," Olmsted wrote, "we Catholics will be compelled either to violate our consciences or to drop health coverage for our employees."

Read more: http://www.azcentral.com/arizonarepublic/news/articles/2012/01/27/20120127phoenix-bishop-defy-feds-birth-control.html#ixzz1m17UNrPW

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

In fact Jim and Dusty, since you applaude Heim's remark, why don't the two of you communicate your last line of your post to the Bishop Burbidge of our Raleigh Diocese. His number is 919--821- 9700. Or you could communicate your last sentence of your post to Father Burch at Sacred Heart, number 295- 6550 or Monsignor Ingham at 692- 6613. I'm sure all three would love to hear from you. Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

CC85 The government has over stepped it's bounds ! Period. They wouldn't be dropping it by choice, it would the government forcing them to do so BECAUSE Abortion and Contraceptive equal the same thing in the eyes of the Church. What if the Government said Hey every Southern Baptist, I know you don't condone drinking or gambling, but all Baptist churches need to particpate in Bingo parties accompanied with alcoholic beverages being served and the proceeds then go towards paying for your employees health coverage. I'd think the Conference of Southern Baptists would take issue and I sure as hell wouldn't blame them. Diane

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

And what? Listen to excuses for all of the cases of child abuse and molestations hidden for years in countries the world over. Tell me about Cardinal Egan, transferred to a cushy job in the Vatican to dodge justice, now retracting his apology for his part in perpetuating that child abuse.

But this masks the real issue here. If the Church wants to persuade its adherents to eschew contraception, that's its right. If it wants to force them to comply, that's out of bounds.

As employees, health care is part of their compensation package. If the Church wants to withhold part of that care, they'd best cough up the cash difference so the employee can exercise her right to have complete coverage.

98% of Catholic women ignore the instruction of the celibate men trying to control their reproduction. That's their absolute right in this country. Maybe you could give me a good quote from Jesus on the topic.

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 3 months ago

JIM HEYMEN, nice retort, but highly expected. Deflect the real issue of Obama trying to control religous faiths to FIT HIS EXPECTATIONS.

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geoffcutler 1 year, 3 months ago

Here, in its rawest form, is the war on Christianity that liberals tell us is a figment of our imagination. A couple of things, Jim. While there is no excuse for the sins of Catholic priests and the molestation of children, the church has paid dearly for those disgusting transgressions, so there is also no excuse for your disgusting jokes after the fact.

And now, since there is no war on Christianity in America, would you care to tell us a similarly disgsuting joke about Islam?

We'll wait....

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

afchief, I once spent a few days in a Seventh Day Adventist hospital. A tenet of their religion is avoidance of meat. But I was allowed to request non-vegetarian meals. How was that not a violation of htier religious rights.

If 99% of sexually active American women choose to use birth control methods not approved by one faith or another, I'd say the problem isn't government overreach. It's a case of religious liberty - something conservatives used to value.

I guess liberty to you means the freedom to force your religious edicts on others. Let American women make their own choices.

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 3 months ago

HEIMEN, wrong again, THIS IS ABOUT GOVT sticking there noses in religous teaching and beliefs and Obama forceing his opinion where is does not belong.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

geoff, You assume facts not in evidence. I am unaware of any evidence to support the assertion tha child molestation by priests is in the past. I have heard no allegations of child molestation in Amercian Muslim mosques. Perhaps you have more information.

In any event, I'm not willing to buy the 'they're doing it too' defense.

It's not the imams trying to force women to bend to their rules in this case. It's not Shariah.

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teufelhunden 1 year, 3 months ago

"And now, since there is no war on Christianity in America, would you care to tell us similarly disgsuting joke about Islam?

We'll wait...."

And wait and wait and wait because after all we wouldn't want to offend anyone. They seem pro Sharia and anti Christianity.

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skylinefirepest 1 year, 3 months ago

Hey, Mike, Diane, and guys...you're beating a dead horse if you expect to get an honest answer out of Jimmy Heim!! He will not answer a question put directly to him to save his life. He'd rather climb a tree and spout the party line than to stand on the ground and tell the truth! Of course the lying Obama has no interest in creating jobs but he'll tell you to your face that he deserves re-election because he has saved or created, Oh a billion or so jobs. WOOPS, MY BAD!!! My wife just reminded me that he didn't lie about those jobs...he just created them in China, Mexico, anywhere but here!!

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CC85 1 year, 3 months ago

When a Catholic organization hires employees from the general public, offers services to the general public, and accepts government money for those services, it should not be allowed to impose its theological conditions on its employees' health care choices by refusing to cover contraception. That is not religious freedom; that is religious imperialism and comes dangerously close to the "establishment of religion" that is prohibited by the Constitution.

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geoffcutler 1 year, 3 months ago

Let's hear the joke, Jim.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

You want a joke? How about this:

*Sealed documents filed in the Archdiocese of Milwaukee bankruptcy identify at least 8,000 instances of child sexual abuse and 100 alleged offenders – 75 of them priests – who have not previously been named by the archdiocese, a victims’ attorney said Thursday.

Archdiocese spokeswoman Julie Wolf said she did not have enough information to respond to the assertion, made by attorney Jeffrey Anderson during a pivotal hearing before U.S. Bankruptcy Judge Susan V. Kelley. Anderson represents about 350 of the 570 victim-survivors who have filed claims in the case.

But Peter Isely of the Survivors Network of Those Abused by Priests speculated that some are likely members of religious orders, such as Capuchins or Franciscans. Order officials do not typically make public the names of their accused members, and the archdiocese claims it is not responsible for them, though they have historically helped to staff its parishes and schools.

But Peter Isely of the Survivors Network of Those Abused by Priests speculated that some are likely members of religious orders, such as Capuchins or Franciscans. Order officials do not typically make public the names of their accused members, and the archdiocese claims it is not responsible for them, though they have historically helped to staff its parishes and schools.

“This is a public safety crisis, a child safety crisis that needs to be investigated,” Isely said at a news conference on the federal courthouse steps, surrounded by fellow survivors and reporters.

“We need to know who they are and where they are. How can there be 8,000 crimes committed by over 100 offenders and there be no accountability?” he said.

Laughing yet? I guess you're not going to vote for Democrats any time soon.

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geoffcutler 1 year, 3 months ago

C'mon Jim. You can do better than that. Who could you possibly offend? Tell us a real dirty one about Muslims. That zinger you told about the Catholic priests just rolled right off your tongue. You must have a slew of em about the Mullahs and Imams.

We'll wait....

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Trust me, as this Obama Care fiascal begins to slowly unravel, it is going to result in a Wake Up Call for many Americans, as well as People in your own Party and the end result will be an implosion of the extreme Liberals power grab they have on theDemocrat Party, like Jim and Dusty are. Diane

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 3 months ago

Well we see that the professionally offended here would rather defend child molesters with their fake indignation than admit a serious problem.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 3 months ago

Meanwhile, here's one for the crybabies:

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geoffcutler 1 year, 3 months ago

Not going to tell us another one, Jim?

Didn't think so.

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fwolferman 1 year, 3 months ago

Jeez everybody, I didn't think it was all that controversial. Never (seldom, anyway) saw so many unsubstantiated facts. Take some deep breaths and think about being rational.

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geoffcutler 1 year, 3 months ago

Fred...welcome aboard! No need for reason here...just business as usual. Good article.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

The fact is that few women care what the Catholic Church says about birth control. No one is forcing them to use contraceptives. Obedience to Church law is entirely voluntary. If the Church can convince women of the rightness of their teachings, birth control will not longer be used and the issue will go away.

In any event, the president solved the problem and religious hospitals and schools will not have to pay for contraceptives. See how easy that was?

And as for the joke, the fact is that the Church would indeed force those unfortunate, innocent children to carry those products of rape to term. I guess the joke would be on them.

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

Just for fun ......................................................................................................................ATTORNEY: This myasthenia gravis, does it affect your memory at all? WITNESS: Yes. ATTORNEY: And in what ways does it affect your memory? WITNESS: I forget. ATTORNEY: You forget? Can you give us an example of something you forgot? WITNESS: How would I know?


ATTORNEY: Now doctor, isn't it true that when a person dies in his sleep, he doesn't know about it until the next morning? WITNESS: Did you actually pass the bar exam?


ATTORNEY: Were you present when your picture was taken? WITNESS: Are you shittin' me?


ATTORNEY: So the date of conception (of the baby) was August 8th? WITNESS: Yes. ATTORNEY: And what were you doing at that time? WITNESS: Getting laid.


ATTORNEY: She had three children, right? WITNESS: Yes. ATTORNEY: How many were boys? WITNESS: None. ATTORNEY: Were there any girls? WITNESS : Your Honor, I think I need a different attorney. Can I get a new attorney?


ATTORNEY: How was your first marriage terminated? WITNESS: By death. ATTORNEY: And by whose death was it terminated? WITNESS: Take a guess.


ATTORNEY: Can you describe the individual? WITNESS: He was about medium height and had a beard. ATTORNEY: Was this a male or a female? WITNESS: Unless the Circus was in town, I'm going with 'a male'.


ATTORNEY: Doctor, how many of your autopsies have you performed on dead people? WITNESS: All of them. The live ones put up too much of a fight.


ATTORNEY: Do you recall the time that you examined the body? WITNESS: The autopsy started around 8:30 p.m.. ATTORNEY: And Mr. Denton was dead at the time? WITNESS: If not, he was by the time I finished.


ATTORNEY: Are you qualified to give a urine sample? WITNESS: Are you qualified to ask that question?


And the best for last:

ATTORNEY: Doctor, before you performed the autopsy, did you check for a pulse? WITNESS: No. ATTORNEY: Did you check for blood pressure? WITNESS: No. ATTORNEY: Did you check for breathing? WITNESS: No. ATTORNEY: So, then it is possible that the patient was alive when you began the autopsy? WITNESS: No. ATTORNEY: How can you be so sure, Doctor? WITNESS: Because his brain was sitting on my desk in a jar. ATTORNEY: I see, but could the patient have still been alive, nevertheless? WITNESS: Yes, it is possible that he could have been alive – and practicing law Must be a local Traffic lawyer.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

Golly, Bentpan, those are much better than my joke.

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

BTW Mr Heim, thanks for ostracising Catholics in Moore county, With you at the helm of Moore County democrats. well lets just say I don't expect us to be overwhelmed here in Moore county, Keep up the good work Moore co. Conservatives are counting on you.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

And about those 20,000 to 100,000 jobs created by the oil pipeline. Cornell University researchers examined the claims and concluded, "Keystone XL could kill more jobs than it creates."

Hmmm. Shall I go with Oil company PR flacks, or neutral researchers. Tough choice.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

Glad to have JimHeim and DR back! Not to support JH's earlier post about poverty statistics, but to educate us on why the Keystone pipeline will (according to JH) have to satisfy "...decades of environmental laws which must be complied with." (4 hours, 8 min. ago).http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-F2qKv69cvN8/Txq5bdKnMfI/AAAAAAAAARA/fMDDa3RNzT4/s640/US-Pipelines.jpg&imgrefurl=http://roanokeslant.blogspot.com/&h=418&w=541&sz=90&tbnid=e_CSMaQa6YqlUM:&tbnh=90&tbnw=116&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dfox%2Bnews%2Boil%2Bpipeline%2Bmap%26tbm%3Disch%26tbo%3Du&zoom=1&q=fox+news+oil+pipeline+map&docid=7wf0cLMo3E11EM&hl=en&sa=X&ei=eqs1T7WfAsS9gAf8k63oBQ&ved=0CIgBEPUBMA0&dur=3625. You mean like the gazillion miles of pipelines that are already there?

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

Mr Heim total BS But hey we can continue to buy oil from our enemies in the Middle East rather than buying from our Canadian friends and that is why you're the head of the local Democrat party.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Heim: First it was : They cling to their guns and their Religion when Obama was speaking to some high rolling Libs in Calif during his campaign. and now it's Catholic Bashing by the Democrat Party. Sorry kiddo, you have opened Pandora's Box. How long do you think it will take the everyday Joe to catch on to the metality level that now exists within the Democrat Party? BTW: care to tell us where you got those stastics on Blacks in NC averaging $7,000 per year VS whites in N C making $150,000? Let me clue you in, I'm not backing down on you providing all us with your source. I will bring it up on every post when I respond to you. Diane

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

Bentpan, Don't you know that oil is not going to be sold here? Why do you think that pipe goes to a coastal port?

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

Gosh Diane. I guess we've lost your vote.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

And speaking of Nebraska, did you know JimHeim that the average net worth for white Nebraskans near the pipeline is $120,000, but for blacks it is only $6000? My source? A post on The Pilot from the local Democratic Chairman. Gospel, you see. Consider further these alarming statistics: (a) as clearly shown in the above map, the Keystone pipeline is "going where no pipeline has ever gone before"; (b) the pipeline will destroy every living species not already destroyed by the gazillion miles of pipeline already in place in the proposed route for several decades; and (c) the underground pipeline will wipe out all migratory birds forever...extinct. With these irrefutable statistics in hand, it is easy to see why you and DR oppose the pipeline. FIGHT THE POWER!

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

Thatcher. Put "black white wealth gap" in your favorite search engine. If you're capable of learning (I make no bets),it will open your eyes.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

By the way, Diane, it would have been more convincing had you not lied about the numbers I used with regard to the black-white wealth gap.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

At the end of the day the contraceptive issue is of no concern. We all know that Catholic women obey all edicts from the bishops, so no contraceptives will be purchased on their insurance. Right?

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

JimHeim 28 minutes ago "Bentpan, Don't you know that oil is not going to be sold here? Why do you think that pipe goes to a coastal port? "

Mr Heim what I Know is that that is where our refineries are, I understand you believe must of us are stupid but I can assure you that is ot the case, Must of us understand our major refining capabilities are at our gulf ports because thats where major imports of crude arrive from the gulf, middle east and south america. I am NOT one of your liberal sheep. I understand and accept the real world.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 3 months ago

By the way, Diane, it would have been more convincing had you not lied about the numbers I used with regard to the black-white wealth gap.

Remember, due to their track record here. everything Miane says should be presumed to be a lie until proven otherwise.

Gosh Diane. I guess we've lost your vote.

They're beyond help or logic. We're pitching to the non-crazies here.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

Bentpan, Since the US is a net exporter of refined fuel (gasoline, diesel), just why do we need more?

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

Mr. Heim I'm Hoping your last post makes more sense to you than it did to me? yes we do import gas and Diesel but the purpose of an OIL PIPELINE IS WHAT?

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

In case you're struggling sir, it is to bring in raw crude oil.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

Thanks JimHeim, but I don't need a search engine. I read your link to UNC's Poverty Center from front to back: nowhere does it support the claims you made in your earlier post (and if you think it does, simply tell us which page...now that you've posted your "source"). Oh, and guess what? http://www.unc.edu/news/archives/feb05/edwards020405.html. Your "source" is none other than John Edwards and his gang, so we know the data is beyond reproach (Reille Hunter videotaped it). To summarize: not even John Edwards supports your posted claims. But you and John have finally convinced me: there are two Americas. One in which John, you, and DR make up "facts" to support liberal ideology; and the other, which most Americans call reality.

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

That needs to be refined.

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

So as to make Gas and/or diesel, end of lesson.

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

Are you getting any of this Mr. Heim or should I type sloooowwweer?

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

Bentpan-- Be patient. JimHeim is explaining why there is too much oil/gas already in the U.S., and why the price at the pump is too low. These are confirmed, reliable statistics, according to John Edward's UNC Poverty Group. Is this complicated? Absolutely. So let's let John Edwards explain this intricate energy process: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7kCAFk.... Let that be a lesson in higher education, and why you should NEVER argue with scientists. The debate is over.

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

Thatcher Thanks for the heads up but I'll have to read Mr. Heims educational piece later, I'm on my way to dinner.

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honesty2 1 year, 3 months ago

Mr. Heim lifted that sick "joke" from another site. I saw it yesterday. Maybe the Huffpo? Sad really, but I think his attack on Catholics is just a deflection of the true issue which many of you have already hit upon- the first amendment.

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honesty2 1 year, 3 months ago

Mr. H- interestingly, I worked at a Seventh Day Adventist Hospital and they only served vegetarian meals.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Heim and DR, based on John Edwards: yeh that'll fly. Diane PS to Dusty, take the black poverty numbers issue up with NC State who conducted the findings. Not me. I report, you do your voodoo with the numbers. Might I add, both you and Heim are looking pretty weak at this point. Diane

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

MikeNC (Diane)-- Here's the pattern I've noticed: if JimHeim posts a joke (like the offensive Catholic joke which led off this thread), DR jumps right in (hence his "ZING!" comment). If JimHeim posts bashing conservatives, DR is one step behind with high-fives. When JimHeim cites "facts" and tries to back them up with actual links, DR waits to see what will happen. If JimHeim cannot back up his "facts", DR disappears and goes to another thread to post, while JimHeim waits a few days then resumes posting like nothing ever happened...and DR joins him again. An amazing thing. Only in America.

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skylinefirepest 1 year, 3 months ago

I'll say again, guys...you won't get an honest, straight answer from Jimmy Heim! If he can't read it out of the loonie leftie liberals guide to success in evading the truth, then he's just stymied. He still, after many trys over several weeks hasn't told me why he's so proud of his party putting his great-grandchildren in hock for thousands the day they're born! He still spouts the party line that the way to financial credibility for the United States is by borrowing money from countries that hate us and then giving it away!! He still can't explain why the government should be allowed by the citizens to have over fifteen percent of money the WE ( not the government, Jimmy ) earn. He still has no explanation why if, say Thatcher, and MikeNC and I pool our money and go into business, risking OUR money not the "governments", why the said government is ENTITLED to a potpile of OUR money!!

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 3 months ago

You know, Thatcher, trying to discern patterns and conspiracies in unconnected events is one of the hallmarks of severe paranoid schizophrenia. Check out the movie "A Beautiful Mind" for an example. Do you have a garage full of clippings tacked to the wall where you crouch, feverishly making connections that don't exist? You might want to seek help.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

Here is scientific evidence of both running to other threads after their "links" and "facts" have been exposed: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtyic1.... John Edwards does not appear in this clip because of copyright issues with Revlon.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

DR-- Check with JimHeim before posting. If you guys aren't on the same page nothing works here. "Unconnected events?" You mean like your posts with JimHeim? Seriously DR, while we have you...JH posted a link which he says supports his poverty figure posts. Can you help us? We can't find anything in this link which supports his post. Will you ask him about it? I know he's busy, but if you say "ZING!" he tends to post alot. Thanks.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

Oh, tell him it's the John Edwards' link he posted. That motivates almost everybody.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

http://pewresearch.org/pubs/2069/housing-bubble-subprime-mortgages-hispanics-blacks-household-wealth-disparity

I can find sources all day. You can play let's pretend all you want. The facts are clear.

And women get free contraception and the Keystone pipeline isn't getting built. And there's nothing you can do about either one. No matter how slowly you type.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

JimHeim-- "The facts are clear." Again?!

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

JimHeim-- "I can find sources all day." We all acknowledge your internet prowess, and John Edwards thanks you for the shout out. Has DR approved the content of your post?

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

JimHeim and DR-- Never give up. Repeat that anyone who disagrees with you and John Edwards is a racist. Repeat phrases like, "The facts are clear." You guys are like a bus, with folks jumpin' on board with your every post. Apparently not.

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JER 1 year, 3 months ago

Hey, what have you guys been talking about? I've been outside taking a nice walk with my dog, listening to the birds sing, breathing in the fresh air, visiting with the neighbors. I've decided I don't care who gets elected to anything because nothing will change, so it makes no difference to me. Both my kids will be responsible for the world my grandchildren will grow up in, so nothing I say or do will change that. I've told them how I feel about where we are today and what I would do if I was going to be around for another 30 or 40 years. It's up to them which way the country goes. At this point, I'm just along for the ride. I've also told them that I was sorry for handing over to them, a world that is so screwed up. My generation came up with a lot of neat stuff, but we didn't make this a better place. We think we did, but we really made it worse. And judging from the discussion here, the next generation is just continuing the downward spiral. So I'm not going to try and make things better anymore. Instead, I'm just going to be an obnoxious old fart who collects his social security check, uses his medicare when he needs it, drive slow in the fast lane, leave my turn signal on, be in line ahead of you at the check out and pick on the very dumb that write letters to the editor and post on this website.

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The_AnonymusProfit 1 year, 3 months ago

Wow, this article's blog took off like a rocket ship. Not surprising considering the partisanship on the blogs. OR, could it be that this article removed some dirt of the tip of what is a cliff that we are teetering on as a country?

Let’s get passed the basic premise that Obama is trumpeting the A typical Liberal message on health care, warping the unemployment numbers to make it seem as if we are actually lowering our unemployment numbers, and basically not doing any real leading while attempting to win an election. What this article, and what many Americans woke up to this week, and I mean really woke up to, was the realization that the cat is so far out of the bag now that only the most ardently blind could possibly misconstrue what Obama's actual agenda is.

Buried beneath the political double talk is something scary....Obama's push for requiring that employers supply contraceptive’s to women has nothing to do with women's health at all, it is a grab for power, power that the executive branch was never meant to have. Mr. Obamas legal team has said that they are well with in their legal rights to require employers to supply contraceptives to women free of charge. This is entirely not true. There is no constitutional foundation for requiring a private company to provide a service such as this, but the argument goes much deeper. Under this guise, if granted the authority to require companies to participate in something such as this, a mandate upheld by a court could possibly, and most likely given the current state of our judiciary, be the premise for the complete eradication of our constitutionally protected rights to property, self-determination, and a litany of others, this could spill over into gun control and second amendment issues, it would invade into our privacy, and the list goes on.

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The_AnonymusProfit 1 year, 3 months ago

Using this power grab as a mandate, there would be no more checks or balances on the president’s ability to order the citizenry of our country to purchase, own, or by law possess, any number of items, policies, or properties. A mandate such as this would solidify the removal of all that we have fought so hard to attain since the founding of our country. Our constitution lays out a frame work for what is known as a limited Federal Government to oversee the tenants of what we understand to be the duties of a government, to protect the people from enemies, foreign and domestic, to provide for the common defense, to negotiate treaties with foreign nations in the best interests of the Union, to provide for the means to create commerce and acquire capital, to provide a network of inter roads and transit ways to allow the flow of goods and services throughout the Union. The constitution does not allow for a Federal body elected, or unelected, to mandate the purchase of goods or services by the individual.

For many Americans on the fence this has been a wakeup call. The last of the fog has evaporated and we see know the road that we have been placed on. A president whose own personal and political philosophies dictate the rights of government over the rights of the people. A president who's influences, Black Liberation Theology, the writings of Karl Marx, Chairman Mao, Joseph Stalin, who’s personal friends and closest allies identify as Communists, Fascists, domestic terrorists, whose blatant and adamant belief in class warfare, anti-capitalism, demand side economics, whose overall disdain for what is the American way of hard work, sweat, dirty hands, good meals, solid families, GOD, Church, and Country is stomach churning, distasteful, and appalling.

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The_AnonymusProfit 1 year, 3 months ago

And the question still remains, will we as a Nation continue to allow these events to take place, will we sit by idle as our rights and liberties are stripped away leaving nothing but serfdom? The American way is a way of freedom and work, the American dream is not guaranteed, IT IS EARNED. The American dream is not to own what the jones have, but to have what is necessary to be a good person, a good role model, a good parent, to provide for one’s family, and to pass those values down to the next generation of Americans. We as Americans are proud of the accomplishments of our wealthiest, we are proud of the accomplishments of our middle class, we are proud of the accomplishments of our poor. We will not be divided, we will not be lied to, WE WILL NOT ALLOW our dreams to be taken from us by a Man and a government who fears no one. People should never be afraid of their governments, their governments should be afraid of them.

To quote our founders, When in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

Skipping Ahead That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shown, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security.

It is High time we understood what these men did. he price good men pay for indifference to public affairs is to be ruled by evil men.

It is my prayer that America will right itself; it is my hope that my children and family will continue to live in a country were freedom above all is the foundation for which we are governed.

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

JimHeim 5 hours, 31 minutes ago .

"And women get free contraception and the Keystone pipeline isn't getting built. And there's nothing you can do about either one. No matter how slowly you type."---------------------

Oh but there is Mr. Heim, in 10 months, through the electorial process, we can rid ourselves of Pres. Obama, pass control of the Senate to conservatives, and further empower our leaders to the congress by adding to the rolls there. So it seems we can, so tell me again how you became a local leader in the political process without knowing how it works.

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

Contraception is not a partisan issue, it's about having choice which is what this country is about. Joining a religion is also a choice and if someone wants to conform completely to the practices of their religion and have a pack of babies they are free to do that but to decide who can and can't have access to birth control is a bunch of BS. Yes, the government is involved in deciding whether insurance companies are allowed to offer birth control because that's how the process works, birth control should have always been part of the insurance package. To discriminate which women can and can't have access to birth control is just wrong. We can't make every rule tailored to every religion, religion is second to the individual of this country.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Thatcher, you have the MO of Heims and Dusty nailed ! BTW Dusty my source for the facts on income between whites and blacks in N C : State Center for HS and Office of Minority Health and Disparities July 2010. Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

SH59 "practices their religion and have a pack of babies" ? WOW! Now I wonder what backlash would of come from the list, had I made that statment against a Muslim, A Baptist, A Jew? Diane

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

Diane, that wasn't a derogatory comment against anyone. My point is that women no matter what their religion is should be able to have choice to use contraception.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Sh: then why say it? Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Sh, ,A thermometer and/or abstinence would have the same end result and be a whole lot cheaper and SAFER. Diane

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

Because we're talking about contraception! Without it a woman will have a pack of babies no mater what her religion is.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Yeh, and I'm also talking about NATURAL protection ways, that are cheaper and Safer.So how com the Left isn't all over the Amish who already got a free pass from Obamacare? Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Oh and to two champions of female justice: The Most Dangerous Place for an African American Woman is in the Womb. This Billboard was placed in NYC by African American Pastor Broden. 58.8 % of Black Women VS 20.3% of White Women have had abortions. How's that Contraception working out for women in NYC? And don't equate it to the Poor Black woman not receiving the Pill for free. Diane

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

Diane, exactly who gave you the right to dictate to other women how they will handle their reproductive lives? At root this comes down to punishing women for having sex. Sadly for your side, this is America, where freedom and liberty still hang on.

And your stats on abortion, while amusing to white people are garbage. Approximately 46% of American women will have an abortion at sometime in their lives. And there are no data to support your assertion...none.

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

The Natural way? Diane, you've got to get over yourself, that's a ridiculous solution and yes, why shouldn't we equate the high abortion rate among poor black women to not receiving the pill for free? You are coming from some moralistic and religious place in your arguments that you are free to exercise because you are lucky enough to live in a country that allows free choice but to use religion to dictate what other women can and can't do in regards to birth control is arrogant and self serving. It's none of your business or the government's business what we do in our sex lives and how we manage our family growth.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 3 months ago

Can someone please tell me what part of the Constitution gives the President the right to order anyone to provide health care to an employee. Don't qoute [sic] laws, pin point [sic] it in the Constitution.

As usual, the people who yell loudest about the Constitution are the ones who apparently don't know jack squat about it.

The ACA was passed by the Congress, doofus, not "ordered by the President."

And their power to do so comes from the Commerce Clause and the Necessary and Proper Clause, both in Article One Section 8.

Please read the Constitution before you yammer about it any further. Please. I'm begging you.

Jesus Christ on a cracker, I cannot believe how bloody stupid some of you are. I come here and I read drivel like this from idiots like wdd101st and whoever Ryan/The AP is plagiarizing from and I literally want to bang my head on the desk in frustration.

How does someone so bloody dumb manage to even turn their computer on? Do the people at whatever care facility you're posting this from do it for you?

Screw this. I'm gonna go walk the dog. I cannot take the stupid any more.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

dustyrhoades 7 minutes ago ... I literally want to bang my head on the desk in frustration

Go for it Dusty....

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

No one is making anyone use contraceptives. You have a constitutional right to do so if you wish. Twenty-eight states have required health plans to include birth control for years with little controversy. If you don't want to use them, that's your absolute right.

Carrying a child to term does not have zero risk. 13 out of every 100,000 pregnancies in the US end in death. That number is going up and would be much higher if religious conservatives had their way. Your church does not have the right to require women to take that risk. It's their choice and theirs alone.

Eevn in America, women deserve the fruits of liberty.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

And who gave you the right to Dictate to the Catholic Church? Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Jim: it doesn't stop at the Pill, it also is for the morning after pill and Abortions. Once you open that threshold of Government having no bars, it's the end. And what Obama said yesterday, was a walk back, BUT it STILL remains on the books. It's like I pointed out SH59, how come you didn't take issue with Obama giving the Amish a free pass? You knlow, one of these days the Left is going to wake up and find that they have finally gotten Women what they deem, is full equality. And one of these days, they will be satisfied they've given Minorities, what the Left feels is justice and when the Left has accomplished their mission, and when they stop and look around, they will find it's only the Unborn that are left to seek justice for. Diane

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

JimHeim-- "Carrying a child to term does not have zero risk." For once, I agree with you. So does John Edwards. "Your church does not have the right to require women to take that risk (e.g. not use birth control). It's their choice and theirs alone." Correct again! And if they want contraceptives, they should pay for it themselves. They have no right to demand that the church pay for it and provide it to them for free. On this, I suspect John Edwards would not agree.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

Sorry, Thatcher, we Democrats are good at keeping our eyes on the bottom line and providing free contraception saves the taxpayers millions of dollars a year. We think that's a good thing.

And the president is not asking churches to pay for it. That was the point of yesterday's decision. A true win-win!

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sgmartin 1 year, 3 months ago

This is the most misinformed community I have ever lived in. And Mike NC (Diane), I am also a Catholic and find the bishops' opposition reprehensible - and have said so formally. You can also contact them by email. Save the call. Glad Obama found a compromise that protects their consciences. Meanwhile just a reminder that contraception decreases the risk of abortion. God bless us everyone.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Jim I think I have the solution. Why put all this contraception crap on the backs of the women, anyway. Why don't all you guys so concerned about a woman's reproductive organs pony up and go get a vasectomy ? Diane

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moonchild7 1 year, 3 months ago

wdd101st's statement of: "And what is wrong with the woman paying for it herself?", is yet another example of the WAR on WOMEN'S health that has been an on-going scandal for way too long. Do you think for one minute that the Catholic Church's health care plans don't pay for the Priest's VIAGRA?!!! Of course they pay for it and wdd101st that's why your SEXIST remark is uncalled for. We are talking about HEALTH CARE that has become an abomination in America. Too many sick people mentally and physically. The President's "AGENDA" for America to have better Preventative Medicine practiced is to make us a stronger nation, not a weaker one. And that is what will happen if this "Anti-HealthCare" bunch of nutz get their way. We'll get sicker, and sicker, and sicker. So, the President has "modified" his requirements and hopefully this "anger" will subside. The President hasn't required any church or religion to stop "preaching" their beliefs concerning birth control/sex/abortions. This is America, believe any crazy thing you want, just don't physically, mentally, or emotionally HARM anyone else if they don't feel the same way. He just wants ALL AMERICANS to be able to obtain decent medical care. And Dusty, you are on a roll. I've been really laughing this morning at all of your "gotcha's" about these CRAZIES.

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 3 months ago

As usual, the Libs cannot see the big picture and continue to make this arguement SOLEY about birth control pills. THE BIG PICTURE is ONCE again OBAMANATION and his cronies forcing there beliefs on others and violating the US Constitution.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

Got my vasectomy at age 21. No regrets. So, what was your point again?

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

afchief, which part of the Constitution would that be? How come he's getting away with it?

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 3 months ago

JIMHEIM, thats great news about your Vasectomey...

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Nezumi 1 year, 3 months ago

If Santorum wins I wonder if there will be a run on contraceptives, like the run on gun ammunition when Obama won.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

afchief, why would it not? Am I supposed to be insulted? You'll have to do a lot better than that.

And by the way, is English your second language? If so, you're doing well. If not ...

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 3 months ago

Too bad your Butt Buddy Dusty didn't have one earlier on...

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

AFCHIEF That kind of talk is to be expected from those whose debate foundation and character are lacking, when you resort to it, you lose credibility. we can not defeat those of inferior standards, beliefs, and character by resorting to their gutter tactics.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

And here's where the morally and intellectually bereft resort to fourth-graderism. A sad end...

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Bentpan 1 year, 3 months ago

Mr Heim you might want to go back and check some of your old posts before you point the finger at anyone.

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dustyrhoades 1 year, 3 months ago

AFCHIEF That kind of talk is to be expected from those whose debate foundation and character are lacking, when you resort to it, you lose credibility.

You can't lose what you never had. AFChief was a brainless lowlife thug from the get-go.

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honesty2 1 year, 3 months ago

I agree with Mr. Heim on one point. Those who abuse their power need to be held accountable. So, how can one turn such a blind eye to the ongoing abuse of power being imposed upon the American people by this current administration? The president and DOJ swore to uphold the Constitution. Are they doing so? No. They are choosing to ignore rulings they do not like (i.e. doma, war powers act, immigration, voter intimidation...); the president is circumventing Congress (czar appointments, ruling by regulation, issueing edicts/mandates, making unConst. appointments); making and spending fiat money and sending/spending this great country into oblivion. The DOJ is anything but- is simply the fox guarding the henhouse- and may very well be involved in illegal gun walking and cover up of murder of a US border patrol agent and countless Mexicans (Fast and Furious). Now let's hear it for seeking the truth, applying justice and punishment for those who abuse our power and trust! Thank you, Mr. Heim for pointing out the need for responsibility and accountability!

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

AFCHIEF 3 hours, 38 minutes ago

"As usual, the Libs cannot see the big picture and continue to make this arguement SOLEY about birth control pills. THE BIG PICTURE is ONCE again OBAMANATION and his cronies forcing there beliefs on others and violating the US Constitution." Isn't it funny how you think the libs are pushing their agenda on the right when the libs think the right is forcing their agenda on everyone else. Why can't we all just do what works for us and leave each other alone. The only way to do that is to open the doors to choice and let the people decide for themselves.

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moonchild7 1 year, 3 months ago

This RIGHT-WING STUPIDITUS MENTALITY really began with the "Impeachment of Clinton" after that bunch of moralistic dead beats decided that they just had to remove such "SCUM" from the White House. Well, it didn't quite work out did it? The White House has been filled with numerous "morally deficient" types since the beginning. As if the Ownership of Slaves, Mass genocide of Native Americans, WaterGate/Enemies Lists, Iran-Contra, and WAR MONGERING aren't the MAJOR types of "misconduct" that should warrant Impeachment.........those Ultra Conservatives(that incuded Newt)from the 90's are totally to blame for this state of GRIDLOCK. They are still MAD and continue to pout like babies. It's time for the Ultra-Conservatives to either Cooperate or get out of Congress. Your Obstructionism is self-serving, mean-spirited and destructive when it comes to progressing our country forward.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

Let's see.... The monthly cost for the pill? About $15- $50 a month. http://www.plannedparenthood.org/health-topics/birth-control/birth-control-pill-4228.htm. How much a month for a cell phone? Ranging from $30- $80 roughly. http://electronics.costhelper.com/cell-phone-plans.html. That does it! Birth control should be free for ALL women, so long as it is ordered via cell phone. In fact, the Catholic church should provide free birth control and free cell phones (how else will the parishioners be able to order their free birth control?). And all you heartless conservatives out there, stop griping! It's "free," which means no one has to pay for it. Sorta like waiving a magic feather. This is Econ 101... "free stuff." Of course, with "free" birth control in hand, the woman and her partner will need a "free" home to share their genuine love. So, using the "free" cell phone, the woman simply calls the White House for "free" housing (or for some rugged rural women, a "free" El Camino). This is a great plan that has worked every time it's been tried. The folks in Greece love it! Remember: the federal government has a role. To provide "free" stuff for folks who don't want to pay for it themselves. It's right there in the Constitution.

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JER 1 year, 3 months ago

A more actively practiced birth control program would have eliminated at least half the posts on this thread and raised the intelligence level by 200%.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

harleyman-- Sure I read what I write. I read what you write, too. Compare your post (1 hour, 3 min. ago) with JER's post (3 min. ago). Which post is more intelligent? Other than a flat tax, JER and I agree on little when it comes to politics. Still, as I have previously posted, JER seems by far the most intelligent liberal on this site. I hope to have a beer with him some day. You should perhaps consider that folks who disagree with you may be as smart as you (based upon your posts, that appears to be a problem...you think that anyone who disagrees with you is stupid, and as a result, your posts are typically limited to calling people stupid). But calling people stupid does nothing to improve your intelligence or advance your argument. That said, if you have specific disagreement with my "free" argument, let us know.

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AFCHIEF 1 year, 3 months ago

Thatch, that was to many words for Scooter Boy to read

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

TO HEIM, MOONCHILD, SG MARTIN, DUSTY AND JER : One MORE time why was there a Senate Bill 3590 passed that EXEMPT CHRISTEN SCIENTISTS, MUSLIMS AND AMISH FROM OBAMACARE??????????????????????????????????????Diane And I will repeat this question until one of you tell all of us WHY

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moonchild7 1 year, 3 months ago

Very Interesting MikeNC but I'm sure you could have done just what I did....and that's to check for the governments "EXEMPTION CLAUSE". So just to let you know there apparently is a "religious exemption" to the Affordable Health Care Act. There's also a "religious exemption" for SOCIAL SECURITY and MEDICARE. So there, if you don't want it you don't have to have it. But guess what MikeNC, there's apparently only TWO...COUNT THEM TWO, religions who have taken it: The AMISH and MENNONITTES. Muslims believe in Health Insurance so they HAVE NOT opted out. They are also NOT against Social Security or Medicare either.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

C'mon DR...just re-read harleyman's post, look for the subtle nuances, then calm down. If I were you and JimHeim, I'd pivot from free birth control to free cell-phone minutes. Some Democrats like that.

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TreadLightly 1 year, 3 months ago

Fortunately I have been too busy today to go online. I notice one thing:

Everyone is trying to frame the argument around contraception. The deal includes the instant abortion pill. That is a huge religious issue.

Who is indignant that the government wants that control over ever person in the country?

The fact is becoming very clear that the choice will be for people who respect religious rights and those who do not. Obama has no visible signs of Christianity, and all visible signs of a tyrant.

NOVEMBER 2012!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

Senate Bill, H.R. 3590, pages 273-274 ... is so complicated but if Mike and Diane really want to know the answers then check it out on the web and give us the exact answer to your question. Don't just take what others tell you as truth.

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JER 1 year, 3 months ago

wdd101st walks into a bar leading a horse. The bar tender says: "What are you doing with that jackass?" wdd101st says: "That's not a jackass, it's a horse." The bar tender says: "I was talking to the horse."

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

SH, It's apparant that H R 3950 is complicated for Moonchild. She claims Muslims are exempt because they have their own insurance. Well let me put your Moon back on course. It's because they DON'T BELIEVE IN INSURANCE. THEY CONSIDER IT A FORM OF GAMBLING.

It's pretty straight forward SH: Our present President Picks and Chooses it's winners and losers. You lose, screw you. (maybe that's why he wants the pill and abortions so badly.) Diane

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

wdd101st: "That is true, but they should also have to right to keep their legs closed if they don't want babies. There is also nothing that requires an employer to buy them either." Tell that to the men who's insurance is paying for their Viagra!

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

Dianne, after doing some research, the Muslims believe that insurance is a form of gambling which is against their beliefs and the Amish live in such an enclosed community with little exposure to the rest of the world that when someone needs medical help they pull their own resources together to pay the bill. Try doing some research instead of posting from your fears and assumptions.

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JimHeim 1 year, 3 months ago

Research? That's cheating!

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

But Sh and Heim WHAT ABOUT THE WOMENS RIGHTS IN THE MUSLIM AND AMISH COMMUNITY?? I mean this was your worst nightmare, right? And Jim I did the research for you and Sh. And Sh, does that mean that the Amish are going to band together to buy the pill for their women folk? Diane.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

As usual, the two of you just proved once again, the hypocrisy of a Liberal. You scream for justice, fairness, (in this case) fairness for ALL women to have control over their reproductive organs, BUT you pick and choose who must abide by your hypocritical thinking and those who must conform. Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

So far the Liberals of Justice and Equality for All have exempted the Muslim Men from letting their wives have control over their reproductive organs. The Amish Men, The Christian Scientist Men. Thousands of Unions from having to comply with Obamacare. Walmart from having to comply with Obamacare, Nancy Pelosi refused to allow Republicans bring a bill to the floor sort of what's good for the goose is good for the gander bill " if Liberal Pelosi and her Liberal cohorts of the house were going to ram this Unconstiutional Bill down the throats of the American people, then they should make congress abide by the same rule". Guess what, Nancy said NO WAY. Diane

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

I agree that all women should have access to birth control regardless of their religion.

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jgc 1 year, 3 months ago

It should be noted that as Governor, Romney did not repeal an identical law in Mass. passed the year before he came into office, and was mantained in his state health care initiative. Is it time for a flip or a flop on this one?

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

But you are wrong SH. Women do have access to birth control and anything else they want, but there is nothing in the constitution that requires me nor anyone else to pay for it. Just as there is nothing in the constitution that requires a woman to have a "pack of babies". I shouldn't have to pay for the Pill no more than I should have to pay for fertility pills. Diane

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SH59 1 year, 3 months ago

Then why are we paying for Viagra?

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moonchild7 1 year, 3 months ago

I brought that same subject up SH59 earlier and there's been no response. But the answer is simple, because MEN run the Insurance and Pharmecutical Industries. The "Pill" has been on the market now for over or about 50 yrs. They should be OTC but are kept on the "Prescription Needed" list to bring more(and at times unneeded)expensive visits to the Doctor and Pharmacy. Money, Money, Money, and It's mean and insane. Again wdd101st all those "other" means of contraception are OTC and NOT prescription. Today there are many of the same brand medicines that are OTC while some are kept as Prescription Only(usually the higher doses). The GOVERNMENT has had to step in when states, corporations, church's and individuals fail. They've FAILED the American people for over a hundred years now when it comes to having health care for all. England after WWI provided Universal Health Care to all because of the need to make their country's HEALTH better after a devastating war. They have had it ever since. I looked up H.R. 3590-142 Sec. 1555: "No individual, company, business, nonprofit entity, or health insurer offering group or individual insurance coverage shall be required to participate in any Federal Health Insurance Program created under this act." The AMISH and MENNONITTE religions are exempt because they provide heaslth care for their own.The government has a list of ALL of the the individual church's . Muslims also don't believe in charging INTEREST on Loans. Think we'll establish those "rules" too, any time soon?

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

You brought up the same point in an earlier post Moonchild about Viagra? Care to go back and refresh our memories as to what you actually posted about Viagra? Good grief girl you're spinning out of control today.

SH,you need to clarify your statement on "us paying for Viagra". If you mean the Unions in some of the Northern States making a taxpayer in that state pay viagra costs as part of their teachers health insurance coverage, then yes. Just like some schools are having their taxpayers pay for a lady's botox treatment. And I didn't say we weren't paying for the pill, we are. Walk into a community's HS and/ or Planned Parenhood ask for one. I said, I don't think I should have to pay for it. Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Wdd, you're right about Margaret, Founder of Planned Parenthood. Here are three quotes from her: Birth Control Review Nov, 1921. " Birth control to create a race of thoroughbreds".

"More children from the fit- less children from the unfit. That is the chief aim of birth control." May 1919.

" The most sucessful educational approach to the Negro is through a religious appeal. We do not want the word to go out that we want to exterminate the Negro population and the minister is the man who can straighten out that idea if it ever occurs to any of their rebellious members" Dec. 10, 1939. After she spoke to the KKK in NJ, she recieved 12 more invitations to speak to other affiliated rallies. Diane

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Nezumi 1 year, 3 months ago

Martin Luther King must have been gritting his teeth in indignation when he was awarded the Margaret Sanger award.

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Yeh another quote of Sanger" the most merciful thing that a large family does to one of it's infants, is kill it." from her article entitled Women and the New Race- Eugenics Publication Co. 1920

Hillary loves the hell out of her. In March 2009, she was presented the Sanger award. she will say " the 20th century reproductive rights movement really embodied in the life and leadership of Margaret Sanger was one of the most transformational in the history of the human race."
Diane

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MikeNC 1 year, 3 months ago

Well Wdd and other Wingnuts, we scored again. Diane

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DannySteen 1 year, 3 months ago

What happens when it goes from contraception and abortion being supplied by the government to you are demanded to use them by the Government? Don't say that that the Government will not be supplying because I know that, for now, that is not the case. But that will change.

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moonchild7 1 year, 3 months ago

What exactly did you score? I put the score at 100 points for the Left and ZERO points for the right. You need to count them up again. wdd101st did you go to school at all? My statement about "The Pill" is one you just don't understand. And neither do you understand the Viagra one either. First The Pill has been around for such a long time that it should be OTC but of course women should consult a physician FIRST. Aspirin can be unsafe if not taken correctly. It's about the insurance and pharmecutical industry keeping it at the prescription level thus making it more expensive. Why aren't any questions being asked about Viagra and insurance coverage? Because it's for MEN"S ED? Of course. The idea that a woman needs to stay at home barefoot and pregnant hasn't gone away with any and all of the CONSERVATIVE minded "FOLKS" out there. From Muslims, to the Amish to Southern Baptists, to 7th Day Adventists. This is about Health and Human Beings but I'm beginning to believe this bunch here only sits in front of FOX NEWS eating Pork Rinds all day.

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Thatcher 1 year, 3 months ago

Hey Geoff, DR, MikeNC, JER, fugitiveguy, wwd, Yukonjohn, etc....how 'bout we go out and get a few beers? I'm buyin'.

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JER 1 year, 3 months ago

Thatcher, thanks for the invitation but I've got to be up early tomorrow. Got several abortions to perform in the AM then on over to the cathedral to hand out condoms to the priests. In the afternoon, I've got a meeting scheduled with some unemployed folks where I'll be giving them some tips on how to avoid getting new jobs so they can continue to get all that free government money. Maybe another time.

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OldSpook 1 year, 3 months ago

One thing I wonder about is how loud would the liberal left be screaming if Mr Obama dictated that the ten commandments shall be placed in all government buildings and schools.

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OldSpook 1 year, 3 months ago

Another thing I wonder about; If the liberials (left) are all for Peace, Love and Hope why is there a constant attack towards the conservatives (right)? Really, I don't give a rats rectum to hear something like "Well they threw the first stone/insult/twist etc." The name calling, snide remarks and thinly veiled threats made by the tender left scares the hell out of me. Is there hope for us as a nation when any disagreement is met with, for now anyway, verbal bashing?

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geoffcutler 1 year, 3 months ago

Thatcher...sounds good! We may have to buy plane tickets for Yukon and possibly JER to get them here.

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JER 1 year, 3 months ago

OldSpook: Don't know about anyone else, but I would be getting pretty loud if anyone dictated that the "top ten" were required in all schools and government buildings. Also, please note that the name calling is not limited to the left. People in the middle and on the right do it also. Some are just better at phrasing it.

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skylinefirepest 1 year, 3 months ago

Hey JER, that's really some day you got planned there...I sort of figured that was what the average working Liberal's day was like!!!

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OldSpook 1 year, 3 months ago

JER, Regretably, while I would like the "top ten" in our schools and government buildings to serve as a reminder, I understand that it would be inappropriate and certainly not supportable. I also understand and believe it a poverty that people cannot disagree without becoming disagreeable.

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