Too Much Power, Not Enough Charity
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Geoff Cutler’s column “Wonderful Reminder To Be Charitable” (April 22) points out that government throwing money at causes doesn’t work. The truth is, we haven’t spent enough. And generally selective charities administered by the privileged class are also insufficient. How does a wealthy country like ours exult in so much poverty? The simple answer is power.
Charity makes sense, but is opposed by a profit-motive culture that encourages the rich to hold on to the bulk of their exploitive gains. And the right’s version of class warfare is topsy-turvy.
Cutler implies that if we let the rich keep more of their money, he will deliver groceries to food banks, etc. But will he do the same if his taxes increase?
It’s often said that the poor are more charitable than the rich, while the latter keep on empire building and assuring privileges for their progeny. Warren Buffett’s son’s plan is limited, and hunger in the richest country in the world is just one of the myriad problems our poor face. Get the rich off the gravy train and redistribute money relatively where it’s needed.
Will that solve the problem? No. Government’s not “the” answer. It’s the only viable answer, but to continue giving the rich a pass will keep things just as they are: good for the few, bad for the many. Many socialist countries spend unthinkably more to provide decent lives and adequate resources for less diverse but increasingly global populations.
That won’t work in the U.S., but surely the amount of money we waste on craving for growth and profit from waste, warfare and luxury would just about abolish the need for charity in this country.
Bob Katrin
Southern Pines
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Comments
Bentpan 1 year ago
Mr. Katrin if you're single, I think you and Moonchild may have been made for each other.
LSM 1 year ago
"Get the rich off the gravy train and redistribute money relatively where it’s needed"
And when that money is gone, what then? Print some more money maybe?
fugitiveguy 1 year ago
" Get the rich off the gravy train and redistribute money relatively where it’s needed."
Where can one travel in this world that this model has worked and that it has not brought that great society to the brink of financial apocolypse? Perhaps we can pool our funds and buy the writer a one way ticket.
fatboy 1 year ago
Mr. Katrin, re-distribution of wealth does not work. Did you ever wonder why there are signs at all of our national parks that read "don't feed the animals"? The reason for that is so that they don't get reliant on hand-outs. It takes away their natural instinct to hunt and fend for themselves.
DaveyNC 1 year ago
What poverty are you talking about, Mr. Katrin? The US is the only country in the world where the poor people are obese.
Sometimes you gain wisdom in strange places. I was once at a deli in Miami and at the table next to me were two Tony Soprano types with what appeared to be a dancer from the Club Bada Bing. One of the Tony's was talking about some tough times in his life and he said something that has stuck with me to this day, 25 years later and it was this: "It's not a sin to be poor in America. It is a sin to stay poor in America."
Well said, don't you think?
geoffcutler 1 year ago
With your type of socio/economic philosophy, Bob, it's a wonder you haven't found some where else to live. The problem is, however, once you got there, you'd see that what Fugitiveguy mentions above, is absolutely true. Astounding!
fugitiveguy 1 year ago
"The US is the only country in the world where the poor people are obese."
and have cars, cell phones, multiple televisions, 2 pack a day habit, etc, etc.
geoffcutler 1 year ago
What was it Churchill said about Socialism? “Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.” Oh yeah, that's it!
bufordsplay 1 year ago
Bob, I have a question as I often do. What do you think the rich do with their money? Because unless they are burying it in the back yard [which they have they right to do] then they are spending it which creates jobs. I challenge you to name these Socialist utopias you speak of!
bufordsplay 1 year ago
Churchill also said that Capitalism is the uneven share of the wealth and Socialism is an equal share of the misery. If Bob has his way we won't all be living in Pinewild, we will all be living across from the Armory.
geoffcutler 1 year ago
Bob, as a sole proprietor, once feds. FICA Medicaid and State taxes are paid, my percentage rate on net income is, according to my accountant, between 40-42%. Is that high enough for you, Bob, or would you like to see it go above 50%? With the few pennies left, I still will look for ways to help.
MikeNC 1 year ago
Bob Katrin states...."Cutler implies that if we let the rich keep more of their money...." Now that is a brilliant concept since that money does belong to them...not others and not you Bob. Most people do not deny our government a fair tax revenue from their paycheck. Nor do they quibble about taking care of those who are in fact needy without the ability to help themselves. They just get sick and tired of the way THEIR tax dollars are wasted and redistributed to able bodied leaches and to bottomless useless pits such as Solyndra, etc, etc, etc When you further say....profit-motive culture that encourages the rich to hold on to the bulk of their exploitive gains. What does Bob do with the bulk of your income? Mike
coffecreme 1 year ago
Well then Geoff go work for someone else so they can pay the employers portion of your fica and medicare. Do you think you should not have to have the same rate because you are self employed?
geoffcutler 1 year ago
Um...Do you know what employers provide Coffee? Do you know who pays the greatest chunk of taxes in America? The sad thing is, the higher taxes get on the entrepreneurs, the job creators, small businesses, the less incentive there is to go into business for yourself. Guess who loses, Coffee? Or is that the goal? Get everyone working for the government...wipe-out small businesses and the private sector? More of the current nonsense, and you may get your wish, because when you wipe out those who employ 75% of all Americans, small businesses, there will be no jobs.
coffecreme 1 year ago
You dont get my point. why am I not surprised.
geoffcutler 1 year ago
"Well then Geoff go work for someone else so they can pay the employers portion of your fica and medicare." Coffecreme
First of all, I wasn't complaining. I was responding to Bob's question about whether I'd give to causes if my tax rates were higher, and I pointed out they are among the highest in the land already. And to you I would suggest, there will be no-one else to work for if small businesses are taxed out of business. It is you who doesn't get the point, and I too, am not surprised.
fugitiveguy 1 year ago
Geoff, I applaud you for making the effort but I believe your last post will be a waste. BTW, anybody know why no DR offering today. I hope he is ok.
geoffcutler 1 year ago
The columns, for whatever reason, have not been added to the website. They'll get here eventually...I think.
MikeNC 1 year ago
geoffcutler 8 minutes ago ...It is you who doesn't get the point, and I too, am not surprised.
I think he did get your point Geoff. But as normal will not respond logically, accurately nor honestly to such questions; and I am not surprised....Mike
SH59 1 year ago
"BTW, anybody know why no DR offering today. I hope he is ok." I'd like to know why the web site doesn't have any new articles today. Didn't they publish a paper this Sunday? I kind of look forward to the new editorials on Sunday Morning and can't understand why they aren't here.
geoffcutler 1 year ago
They'll probably have Sunday's columns up tomorrow morning when everyone gets back to work. Glad to hear you look forward to Sunday's columns, even though they are not editorials. Editorials belong to the paper, left hand side, no name signed, newspaper's opinion. Dusty is a columnist, signed... opinion.
DaveyNC 1 year ago
OK, coffeecreme, I am going to try to explain something to you that will blow your mind IF you grasp the concept. Here it is: When you work for someone, YOU are paying your share of the taxes AND what you call the "Employer's portion".
Here's why: When an employer decides to hire someone for, say, $30,000 a year he budgets more than $30,000. I don't remember the exact percentage, but for argument's sake, let's say he budgets 10% for taxes over that, so $33,000 is budgeted. Then, he adds on another $3,000 for benefits. So, you cost that employer $36,000, of which you receive $30,000 less taxes. So, you take home probably about $23,000. In all, you paid about $13,000 in order to have that job and those benefits.
Now, contrast that with my personal favorite, the Fair Tax. You get paid $36,000. You pay $3000 for your benefits, you take $33,000 home. You receive a check each month for an amount equal to the taxes you would pay on things like food, etc. based on federal poverty guidelines. For a family of four, that's probably worth another $4-500 a month. That money is in your pocket and is untaxed unless you spend it on new items. Buy a new shirt, pay about a 23% federal tax on it. Don't buy the shirt, don't pay the tax. Buy a shirt at a yard sale, no tax. You cost your employer exactly the same but the money is in your pocket and under your control.
Just dreamin', I know.
moonchild7 1 year ago
Is there anybody out there? Are there any people out there in Moore County who undestand how the RICH and POWERFUL are DESTROYING our country? I am NOT the LA-LA-LA stupified brainless person you guys call me and think of me most of the time. Did any of you guys read the 4/28/12 issue of the NYT's? "...with a handful of employess in a small office here in Reno,NV, Apple has dome something central to it's corporate strategy, it has avoided millions in dollars in taxes in California and 20 other states." Just to let you know from further down in the article nevada has a ZERO corporate tax rate while California's is 8.84%. Apple paid about $3 BILLION DOLLARS less in taxes last year because of these LOOPHOLES and their GREED. Apples CORPORATE tax rate came out to less than 10% last year and Walmart's was about 24%. The Republicans continue their lies about our HIGH Corporate tax rates. What do the rich do with their money? Yes, some of them hoard it, some of them give to charity, some make decent investments but probably a majority of them do what ever they can to contiue being RICH at all costs. The small and very rich town in CT that my sister and her family lives in is losing the towns small businessmen and their family businesses in droves lately. Why? Because the RICH who own the real estate keep going up on rents and of course property taxes keep going up. Soon there will be no local small businessmen there. Plus they tend to NOT BUY local. They spend their $$$$ in NYC. And as far as the "Socialism" issue that was brought up, Geoff, please read some HISTORY BOOKS. Hitler's Socialism(the one Churchill was referring to) was a NATIONALISTIC ARYAN SOCIETY composed of WHITE, BLOND HAIRED, BLUE EYED perfect beings. America is NOT THAT and will hopefully never become that. But who know's anymore the way things are going with the WORSHIPING of the RICH and their MONEY in this country.
Courseaire 1 year ago
I understand that there are people that are bent on destroying our country, but trying to put the blame on the rich and powerful is misguided at best. Those trying to destroy the Country come from all across the board - rich, poor, politicians, educators and middle income. Sure there are a few bad rich/powerful people, but only a few. There are many more that are not rich/powerful that have a greater impact on the country - many of those are the lazy that would rather bleed you and the country dry then be a productive member of society and earn their way in life.
geoffcutler 1 year ago
"Is there anybody out there? Are there any people out there in Moore County who undestand how the RICH and POWERFUL are DESTROYING our country? I am NOT the LA-LA-LA stupified brainless person you guys call me and think of me most of the time." Moon
Moon, for heaven's sake, what do you want us to think when you say stuff like this? As we mentioned to Bob, there are plenty of places you can live if capitalism and the American way is so abhorrent to you. Until then, you just sound kooky. Sorry..
DaveyNC 1 year ago
Moonchild, I know that you have seen this, but if you want to be taken seriously around here, pay attention to what geoffcutler wrote above and then go and read this one more time: http://goo.gl/amnnb
Buried in all your mooniness there is usually a cogent point, but who wants to read that stuff the way that you write? You're writing to an audience here and you have made yourself easy to ignore. You have to win us over, not freak us out.
geoffcutler 1 year ago
I remember seeing that link posted on here once before. Very useful to all of us. Thank you for posting it again.
Thatcher 1 year ago
MC7-- If you want to know the "truth" about Apple's "GREED," read this. http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2012/04/30/apples-9-8-tax-rate-new-york-times-ignorance-again/. The whole story to which you refer is a lie. In addition, there is no such thing as a "LOOPHOLE." They are called lawful deductions under our tax code (Congress made these deductions, not Apple, not you, and not me). If you own a house, you can lawfully deduct your mortgage interest from your tax bill. Do you do that? I do. I presume others here do as well. You can also deduct dependent children. Know what? You don't have to deduct any of these things if you don't want to, and if you do deduct them, you are not using a LOOPHOLE. And if you do deduct them, then using your logic, lots of folks on here are guilty of "GREED," as you define it. Perhaps even you. Hope that helps.
mcgal 1 year ago
Passion is difficult to transfer to the written page. Moon's posts reflect her passion in the subject matter at hand.
Thatcher 1 year ago
mcgal-- Passion is a great thing, but devoid of actual facts, it is a wasted exercise.
geoffcutler 1 year ago
Passion, while an excellent quality, perhaps empathy or emotion are better terms, are not, unfortunately, the best leaders of common sense and reason, especially when it comes to the successful maintenance of a country like ours. Churchill also had something to say on this subject.
moonchild7 1 year ago
Thank you mcgal. I've never had anyone on here understand me so well and say it so nicely. Passion is such a huge part of my personality and is why I've been successful in so many of my pursuits in life. Sorry that it takes me into the upper atmoshepheres when I try to "tell my stories" and try to explain why I think the way I do. A lot of my life I never had a lot of encouragement and have had to "fight" (especially emotionally and verbally) for what I believe in. I DO NOT regret my "fighting spirit and passion". DaveyNC, I've read that before. I am ignoring it. Why is Forbes more reliable than the NYT Thatcher? I do not deduct the mortage interest anymore Thatcher since both of my homes are paid for. Everything I own is paid for and no more Earned Income Tax Credit or ChildCare Credits. Thatcher those tax "loopholes" don't hardly compare with the HUGE loopholes the wealthy and the Corporations get. They have the money to influence congress to make sure they create them and pass them as law. My statements about the rich aren't that kooky just to let you know. Why" because they are destroying the town my sister lives in. The families who have lived and own property there won't be able to be there much longer. The average home lists for a sale price of $2 million and sells for about $1 million. My nephews have family businesses but might not last much longer with the pressure they are getting from the RICH to buy their property and displace them. Minimum wage workers have to be bused in to work the jobs at the grocery stores and restaurants. My sisters been there since 1962 when she first married and bought her house for $20,000. It's paid for but when she retires she'll probably have to move since the property taxes are outrageous. The wealthy people there have no conscience and could care less what they are doing to the few "low-incomed" people left in the town; and what some of those people have to do to get by. They are blind to the needs of many of their neighbors and will do anything to make sure there are none of them left. That little town in CT is just a microscopic view of how they operate. I lived there as a kid and have visited almost every year since. I know what I'm talking about. Many of the wealthiest people in the US live there.
Thatcher 1 year ago
Thanks, MC7. You made my point for me.
DaveyNC 1 year ago
Moonchild, methinks you took the things at that link to heart, for your last post here is actually readable. Long on statements and short on facts to support those statements, but readable.
The rich aren't evil and the poor aren't virtuous. People at all levels only ever do what is in their best interestes, no more and no less. That's all and to expect otherwise is to ignore reality.
moonchild7 1 year ago
Casino Banking, Bizillion Dollar Bonuses, Corporate Tax Shelters, Cash-Infused Ego's and Human Greed are NOT figments of my imagination. They are REAL, they are CURRENT and they are a BIG part of what is destroying America.
Courseaire 1 year ago
Risk based investments, Incentive Awards/Shared Profits, Corporate Tax Incentives, Investors Profits/Losses based on Investment Risk & Humans need to Succeed/Excel are not figment of my imagination. They are real and are what make this Country great.
geoffcutler 1 year ago
American ideals versus...God only knows....
FightFireWithFire 1 year ago
There is a thin line between reality and denial in this country. People have become addicted to denying that they are the source of most of their own problems. Obesity is rampant because people have excuses that they didn't use 50 years ago. Advances in medicine have allowed people the freedom to still live bad lifestyles knowing that medicine is there to save them. The transition from an agrarian society to an industrial society and on to a technology based society has also engineered people to behave a certain way. Why work your a$$ off on a farm when you can go to college and go work for Microsoft making good money? As a result, people spend more time in an office setting in front of a computer instead of working the fields. I think we can see the correlation to obesity levels.
JD 1 year ago
Also check out the costs in the grocery store. Obesity is not just Mickey D's. Its the mom on EBT that buys the stouffers lasagna because it is on special and they can stretch out what little is on the card. Compare next time you are in the store: Which costs more? A pound of vegetables or a pound of meat? If you can get more meat than veggies that is part of the obesity problem occurring.
moonchild7 1 year ago
"God only knows..." Yes Geoff, SHE knows a lot about me and who I am. Not quite the "Looney" you keep saying that I am. But think what you want, you can certainly have all the "Not so great" beliefs yourself and we'll just have to think in those SEPARATE REALMS and go on with our lives. Oh, one more thing. You won't believe me because I'm making the claim but I am the epitome of AMERICAN IDEALS. I studied hard in school so that I could graduate and attend college. I was the first in my family to graduate from college. I worked many different jobs in my life, saved money, bought and sold homes, raised a wonderful kid, paid my bills and taxes, almost always votes, gives to others, helps others whenever I'm needed, and have NEVER been in toruble with the law. Those "Ideals" of Liberty, Equality, Democracy are ones that I have practiced my entire life and as a Social Worker and even now have taught others how to better themselves and their communities. I'm a GIVER and NOT a TAKER. What say you?
AFCHIEF 1 year ago
MC7, you qoute I'm a Giver and Not a Taker. SO THEN WHY do YOU support the liberals who want to take MY HARD earned money and give it to people who don't want to work for there own money.