I'd bet a sandwich that the church was built long before any UDO and any zoning designation, which makes you point a mute one. The Church is a permitted use, to argue that it isn't a correct classification is an opinion, not a fact.
From day one, the church has been a permitted use. Read the RLUIPA statute, and I think that you will have a clearer picture of why this project will go forward.
Harvey, with all due respect get your facts straight, the village chapel is not requesting a variance, they are requesting a major special use permit. There is a big difference, the property for the village chapel is zoned correctly.
One Point I make that hasn't been addressed is a federal agency getting involved in local zoning that could have RLUIPA issues.
My opinion, RLUIPA is either good or overreaching. If you read the cases that have been argued, many churches used RLUIPA to overcome very abritrary city decisions.
Southern Pines is a Prime example. Bart Nuchols arbitrarily decided that the Catholic school was not a permitted use under the UDO, but the UDO clearly stated that Churches (and school buildings) were a permitted use. Bart arbitrarily decided that the church had to be built first, then the school could be built. There is no city in america that can decide upon themselves what a church is, and the Catholic school would be celebrating mass in the class. The church owned over 20 acres, had a rectory and cemetary on the site. The school had to appeal the decision to the Board of Adjustment, which requires a super majority.
Thanks goodness the BOA ruled in favor of the church, but even Doug Gill tried to argue that RLUIPA didn't apply, which he was dead wrong. He tried to argue that a local school did not fall under the pervue of the federal law since interstate commerce did not apply, which is dead wrong. Construction and education are both covered under the interstate commerce clause, and RLUIPA does apply.
My point it that sometimes town leaders are more interested in their power, deciding what they want in town, and not interested in their citizens ability to practice their faith, or what the citizens want.
There are two facts that are not in the record so far. The National Parks Service has no standing in the Pinehurst UDO . Their Quasi Demand to review plans is huge overreach. Why does some federal beauracrat think he can demand to review plans? The Historic Commission must make their judgement based on the facts, and there is no bearing in the code as to letting the NPS review plans.
Secondly, I have yet to hear anyone refer to RLUIPA (Religious Land Use and Institutionalised Persons Act). Here is the preamble to the law of 2000
SEC. 2. PROTECTION OF LAND USE AS RELIGIOUS EXERCISE.
(a) SUBSTANTIAL BURDENS-
(1) GENERAL RULE- No government shall impose or implement a land use regulation in a manner that imposes a substantial burden on the religious exercise of a person, including a religious assembly or institution, unless the government demonstrates that imposition of the burden on that person, assembly, or institution--
(A) is in furtherance of a compelling governmental interest; and
(B) is the least restrictive means of furthering that compelling governmental interest.
There have been many federal cases in terms of religious use of land, and the courts nearly always find that the religious institution is to be given the broadest leaway in developing their property.
The NPS may be sticking it's nose in a tent (RLUIPA) that is way beyond it's purview.
Moochelle Obama trip to Spain was a telling story. They don't care about what's going on, they care about getting as much as they can in four years.
I doubt that fuel and staffing were budgeted, and if it was, was it not a waste? Could she not spend her money in the US, by God I'm sure some of our state's could use the business.
Thank God Pelosi will be fired in November. I'm not sure Boehner is up to the job though.
Obama is a only a giant in his own eyes. McCrystal did the right thing and resign, but Obama in the end is a midget. A community organizer with no experience. That's what we have plain and simple, plus a radical agenda.
Mr. Kindsvatter makes a grave error in his assumptions, that being that taxes provide for our high quality of life. By that premise, taxes (and government) are providers of our high quality of life, not the work of our own making.
This is a fundamental difference in thinking between liberals and conservatives. Liberals think our standards are granted to us by the government where conservatives believe we grant our standards to ourselves by our individual accomplishments.
If the Pilot was worth their salt, and do some sort of investigative reporting (which it has not done) it would find out under freedom of information what the prior salary was of Ms. Beale, and what the salary is of the new associate superintendent. We'll then see if Ms. Purser is telling the truth.
irishman 2 years, 6 months ago
Southern Pines Council Approves PD Amendment
There is an element in our community to stop any and all development, regardless of permitted uses and zoning (note see melzabeth comments above).
There is very little regard for property rights in this town, and one day they may wake up and wonder why we are drying up as a community.
irishman 2 years, 7 months ago
Playing the Game
@ncsnafu
I'd bet a sandwich that the church was built long before any UDO and any zoning designation, which makes you point a mute one. The Church is a permitted use, to argue that it isn't a correct classification is an opinion, not a fact.
From day one, the church has been a permitted use. Read the RLUIPA statute, and I think that you will have a clearer picture of why this project will go forward.
Just My Opinion, and I appreciate yours
irishman 2 years, 7 months ago
Playing the Game
Harvey, with all due respect get your facts straight, the village chapel is not requesting a variance, they are requesting a major special use permit. There is a big difference, the property for the village chapel is zoned correctly.
irishman 2 years, 7 months ago
Historic Commission Approves Village Chapel Project
@CSmithson
One Point I make that hasn't been addressed is a federal agency getting involved in local zoning that could have RLUIPA issues.
My opinion, RLUIPA is either good or overreaching. If you read the cases that have been argued, many churches used RLUIPA to overcome very abritrary city decisions.
Southern Pines is a Prime example. Bart Nuchols arbitrarily decided that the Catholic school was not a permitted use under the UDO, but the UDO clearly stated that Churches (and school buildings) were a permitted use. Bart arbitrarily decided that the church had to be built first, then the school could be built. There is no city in america that can decide upon themselves what a church is, and the Catholic school would be celebrating mass in the class. The church owned over 20 acres, had a rectory and cemetary on the site. The school had to appeal the decision to the Board of Adjustment, which requires a super majority.
Thanks goodness the BOA ruled in favor of the church, but even Doug Gill tried to argue that RLUIPA didn't apply, which he was dead wrong. He tried to argue that a local school did not fall under the pervue of the federal law since interstate commerce did not apply, which is dead wrong. Construction and education are both covered under the interstate commerce clause, and RLUIPA does apply.
My point it that sometimes town leaders are more interested in their power, deciding what they want in town, and not interested in their citizens ability to practice their faith, or what the citizens want.
Just my opinion.
irishman 2 years, 7 months ago
Historic Commission Approves Village Chapel Project
There are two facts that are not in the record so far. The National Parks Service has no standing in the Pinehurst UDO . Their Quasi Demand to review plans is huge overreach. Why does some federal beauracrat think he can demand to review plans? The Historic Commission must make their judgement based on the facts, and there is no bearing in the code as to letting the NPS review plans.
Secondly, I have yet to hear anyone refer to RLUIPA (Religious Land Use and Institutionalised Persons Act). Here is the preamble to the law of 2000
SEC. 2. PROTECTION OF LAND USE AS RELIGIOUS EXERCISE. (a) SUBSTANTIAL BURDENS- (1) GENERAL RULE- No government shall impose or implement a land use regulation in a manner that imposes a substantial burden on the religious exercise of a person, including a religious assembly or institution, unless the government demonstrates that imposition of the burden on that person, assembly, or institution-- (A) is in furtherance of a compelling governmental interest; and (B) is the least restrictive means of furthering that compelling governmental interest.
There have been many federal cases in terms of religious use of land, and the courts nearly always find that the religious institution is to be given the broadest leaway in developing their property.
The NPS may be sticking it's nose in a tent (RLUIPA) that is way beyond it's purview.
irishman 2 years, 8 months ago
Countering a Complaint
Moochelle Obama trip to Spain was a telling story. They don't care about what's going on, they care about getting as much as they can in four years.
I doubt that fuel and staffing were budgeted, and if it was, was it not a waste? Could she not spend her money in the US, by God I'm sure some of our state's could use the business.
Thank God Pelosi will be fired in November. I'm not sure Boehner is up to the job though.
irishman 2 years, 8 months ago
Obamas Are Out of Touch
Remind me, what official business was Moochelle Obama on while in Spain?
irishman 2 years, 10 months ago
Political Cartoons Took a Cheap Shot
Obama is a only a giant in his own eyes. McCrystal did the right thing and resign, but Obama in the end is a midget. A community organizer with no experience. That's what we have plain and simple, plus a radical agenda.
irishman 3 years, 1 month ago
Missing the Point
Mr. Kindsvatter makes a grave error in his assumptions, that being that taxes provide for our high quality of life. By that premise, taxes (and government) are providers of our high quality of life, not the work of our own making.
This is a fundamental difference in thinking between liberals and conservatives. Liberals think our standards are granted to us by the government where conservatives believe we grant our standards to ourselves by our individual accomplishments.
irishman 3 years, 2 months ago
Purser: No Additional Cost for Associate Superintendent
If the Pilot was worth their salt, and do some sort of investigative reporting (which it has not done) it would find out under freedom of information what the prior salary was of Ms. Beale, and what the salary is of the new associate superintendent. We'll then see if Ms. Purser is telling the truth.